WARNING: Noodler's Inks

In article , "~****-magnet~" wrote:
[snip] Right now there's Pelikan ink in it, from the bottle that comes with
the pen. I'd still like to try the Noodler's and if the pen "likes"
the ink, continue using it. Funny, I coordinate my pen body colors

yes, some pens seem more picky about ink. however, all my 3 Pelikans are quite
easy going.

an old old bottle of Carter green ink that I bought at a five & dime
store in 1958 and it offered up a nice bonus of bunches of polkadots.
[snip]

polkadot ink?

bye now,

==========
Pam @ Home

Cort Furniture Rental and Honesty are two mutually exclusive concepts.

"Chuck Swisher" wrote in message
news:96vfg.205965$5Z.10294@dukeread02...

I beg your pardon, but I never said anything about proving your pens
weren't
flowing properly, I asked for proof that Noodler's ink had
permanently
damaged a Pelikan nib. Please read again and you will see that I
said some
of these inks might not flow that great in pens with feeds that very
fine
ink channels. Here is what I wrote to your first post:

On 5/30 at 11:05A in this thread, you said:
"I wasn't attacking anyone, just asking for proof that Noodler's ink
did in
fact damage a Pelikan nib beyond repair. Give me this proof and you
can say
anything you like about this ink, until then I will continue to
challenge
anyone that makes these claims on a public forum without proof to
back-up
these claims."

I never claimed anywhere that your ink ruined my Pelikan. In fact I
have not loaded my Pelly with your ink to date. I said that 2 pens
dried up and they subsequently cleaned okay without any damage being
done. I also said they never dried up before using other brands of
ink. You challenged me on the wrong claim. If you want to know who's
pen nib was reported to have been DAMAGED by NOODLER'S ink, why don't
you contact THAT PERSON directly. You know who he is. More likely he
would be your friend and/or business associate... I have never met
the guy. We exchanged a number of communications about a number of
things concerning fountain pens. He appears to be a pen expert and
should discuss the technical aspects of your ink and his Pelican. If
you are polite, I'm sure he would give you useful information...
unless you feel your ink is perfect and can do no wrong. I still think
you are being overly hostile. If that is some indication that you
aren't reacting rationally, we aren't doing either one of us any good;
We're having an obvious failure of communications and I prefer that we
terminate this exchange now.

On Thu, 1 Jun 2006 05:13:49 -0400, "-Moonstone-"
wrote:

I never claimed anywhere that your ink ruined my Pelikan. In fact I
have not loaded my Pelly with your ink to date. I said that 2 pens
dried up and they subsequently cleaned okay without any damage being
done. I also said they never dried up before using other brands of
ink. You challenged me on the wrong claim. If you want to know who's
pen nib was reported to have been DAMAGED by NOODLER'S ink, why don't
you contact THAT PERSON directly. You know who he is. More likely he
would be your friend and/or business associate...

And this is a problem. If you check the scam boards, you'll find that
many of them attack a business by reporting what 'another person told
another person'. The real hope is that many people end up telling
people how Walmart tried to steal money at the cash register or Post
had a cereal box with gravel in it. You do have to realize that
reporting a second hand report is the form of a classic scam attack.

After years of reading this type of attack and finding them false, my
first reaction is to discount the story and hold its source in
question. In fact, my wife told me the Walmart story yesterday and
after a few questions, it was clear that there was nothing of
substance.

You were the source, if not the originator, on this list of the story
about the nib and that was the less believable item. I think his
response was reasonable, even if your intent was benign. It wasn't
much sharper than my conversation with my wife - the difference being
she took no offense. After all, she had no reason to feel defensive
about someone else's story...

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

"Curtis L. Russell" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 1 Jun 2006 05:13:49 -0400, "-Moonstone-"
wrote:

I never claimed anywhere that your ink ruined my Pelikan. In fact I
have not loaded my Pelly with your ink to date. I said that 2 pens
dried up and they subsequently cleaned okay without any damage
being
done. I also said they never dried up before using other brands of
ink. You challenged me on the wrong claim. If you want to know
who's
pen nib was reported to have been DAMAGED by NOODLER'S ink, why
don't
you contact THAT PERSON directly. You know who he is. More likely
he
would be your friend and/or business associate...

And this is a problem. If you check the scam boards, you'll find
that
many of them attack a business by reporting what 'another person
told
another person'. The real hope is that many people end up telling
people how Walmart tried to steal money at the cash register or Post
had a cereal box with gravel in it. You do have to realize that
reporting a second hand report is the form of a classic scam attack.

After years of reading this type of attack and finding them false,
my
first reaction is to discount the story and hold its source in
question. In fact, my wife told me the Walmart story yesterday and
after a few questions, it was clear that there was nothing of
substance.

You were the source, if not the originator, on this list of the
story
about the nib and that was the less believable item. I think his
response was reasonable, even if your intent was benign. It wasn't
much sharper than my conversation with my wife - the difference
being
she took no offense. After all, she had no reason to feel defensive
about someone else's story...

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

When I realized I had to provide the name of the "offended pen user",
I regretted passing the info along because I hadn't planned to reveal
the source (out of courtesy to the source.) Many people won't pass
good info when they think you'll drop their names around. Casual
chatter works similarly to news reporters guarding their sources.) How
many people here would have the nerve to criticize this brand? All I
know is I reported the facts, without embellishment. I don't
understand why it inflamed so many people. It's not hard to believe
the ink dried 2 pens. It's also not hard for me to believe an "pen
expert" when he says the ink ruined his nib. In the future, if I get
what I believe to be good useful info, I'll keep it to myself and pass
it along via private email to a privledged few and I won't get caught
up in a trap like that again. I very seldom need to verify what I say
in the real world. In consideration of all the BS that gets tossed
around online, I suppose I need to be more vigilant of my surroundings
and anonymous status. Thanks for your thoughts.

On Thu, 1 Jun 2006 09:55:36 -0400, "-Moonstone-"
wrote:

It's not hard to believe
the ink dried 2 pens. It's also not hard for me to believe an "pen
expert" when he says the ink ruined his nib.

I, on the other hand, do find it hard to believe if you are talking
about fountain pen ink. The only time Noodlers impacted a fountain pen
nib on one of my pens was when I tried to get the last bit of ink out
of the bottom of the bottle and I hit the bottom a bit hard. That's
why I move it to MB ink bottles - lousy ink, but IMO great bottles...

Quite simply, I've never had a nib destroyed, damaged or bothered by a
fountain pen ink. I really can't even imagine how it could be.
Something coorosive designed for a dip pen, perhaps, but even a
corrosive I would expect to do in the seals before the nib.

So, no, I can't believe that, even if repeated in good faith.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

On Thu, 1 Jun 2006 09:55:36 -0400, -Moonstone- wrote:

It's also not hard for me to believe an "pen
expert" when he says the ink ruined his nib.

To come back in on this and address the issue rather than the earlier
controversy: I, too, would think that unlikely. That's not to criticise
you for bringing the point up in good faith, Moonstone, but I've tried a
lot of inks over the years. Some of them have been poor, as inks go, but
none has ever done any of my pens any harm. I don't have a closed mind
about it. If the evidence was presented by the pen's owner it would have
to be given consideration but, really, it hardly seems possible. Even back
in the day, when some inks were quite caustic - and I'm talking about a
long time ago, before modern fountain pen inks were formulated - it took a
lot of use before the damage was apparent.

In the future, if I get
what I believe to be good useful info, I'll keep it to myself and pass
it along via private email to a privledged few and I won't get caught
up in a trap like that again.

I hope you change your mind. We should not be intimidated into silence by
others' hypersensitivities. The group's for the discussion of all things
relating to pens and pencils. People may wish certain topics within that
to be off limits but there's no reason why we should oblige them.

--
Sem

"Semolina Pilchard" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 1 Jun 2006 09:55:36 -0400, -Moonstone- wrote:

It's also not hard for me to believe an "pen
expert" when he says the ink ruined his nib.

To come back in on this and address the issue rather than the
earlier
controversy: I, too, would think that unlikely. That's not to
criticise
you for bringing the point up in good faith, Moonstone, but I've
tried a
lot of inks over the years. Some of them have been poor, as inks
go, but
none has ever done any of my pens any harm. I don't have a closed
mind
about it. If the evidence was presented by the pen's owner it would
have
to be given consideration but, really, it hardly seems possible.
Even back
in the day, when some inks were quite caustic - and I'm talking
about a
long time ago, before modern fountain pen inks were formulated - it
took a
lot of use before the damage was apparent.

In the future, if I get
what I believe to be good useful info, I'll keep it to myself and
pass
it along via private email to a privledged few and I won't get
caught
up in a trap like that again.

I hope you change your mind. We should not be intimidated into
silence by
others' hypersensitivities. The group's for the discussion of all
things
relating to pens and pencils. People may wish certain topics within
that
to be off limits but there's no reason why we should oblige them.

--
Sem

So the ink dried 2 of my 5 pens out. I know about it and will take
reasonable steps to preventing it from happening again. It wasn't one
of my pens that was damaged. You'll need to talk to the guy over at
Pens-More and get those details. I don't know this guy any more than
you know me. It is likely that the regulars of this ng know Travis a
whole lot better than I. Does anyone here care to offer references for
Travis at Pens-More? In dealing with him from day to day, has anyone
found him to be honest and reliable or something less? Is he or is he
not considered an "expert" by his peers? I have been using FPs all my
life but I am hardly an expert to explain how or why something may or
may not have happened. Unless someone tells me that Travis has a
character disorder, I'll give him the benefit of doubt. Am I willing
to take a chance and try Noodler's in my new Pelly? Based on what
everyone in here has said, the answer is an unequivocal yes. Beyond
that, I can not offer up any more.

We're getting ready to storm and I need to tie a boat down. L8r Sem.

Calvin Romanoff a écrit :

Mr./Ms. S. Magnet,

I very seldom have anything to say in public newsgroups but I
find participation as a lurker very helpful. Please allow me to
express my opinion that is neutral and hopefully openminded, based
soley on observation.

First of all, you stamp yourself (or allow yourself to be) with
a username that at the very least is impolite. At worst, it casts a
negative "first impression" suggesting that you may be looking for
trouble. You explained the reason but I ponder why you couldn't have
taken a moment to temporarily modify it to a more innocuous version.

Secondly, I assume you are a virtual stranger in this group. In
other words, people don't know who you are or what your motives may
be. There is a lot of "trolling" that occurs everywhere. This is cause
to be naturally suspicious of anything that may seem irregular.

It is my nature to give people a benefit of doubt until they
have demonstrated beyond a reasonable doubt that they are not
presenting themselves in good faith. You impressed me as a person that
seemed alarmed by an experience and that you attempted to communicate
in good faith. I wasn't suspicious because in my 48 years of
experience with fountain pens, I know that under many circumstances,
any pen can be incompatible to all degrees with any ink. One simple
test with ink is observing if an ink beads up on a nib or remains
uniformly coated. If you find the situation to be the latter, it is a
good indication that the ink may be too viscous for some pens. You can
not judge a pen by it's maker since all pens have variations.

I believe there was no cause for your credibility or motivation
to be openly questioned or attacked but I can see where others were
unnecessarily being rude and preferring to bicker rather than offer
help. There again, you have to understand that there are small
enclaves of people that too quickly defend others. Although some of it
I believe is through a genuine innocent act of loyalty, the
"gun-jumpers" may be "bandwagoning" in the hope of "getting a better
deal" somewhere down the pike. Collecting pens can be a passion, and
an expensive one at that, so although as disingenuous as some may be,
and biting as they may have been to you, it could offer an advantage
when landing that "must have" pen or purchasing a bottle of ink. Also
there are certain personality types, sort of the "high-strung old
biting queen" kind that have to pick at everything. No offense
intended, I'm also an old queen, but the more mellow gentle sort.
Please don't leave the group thinking everyone are assholes (please
excuse the expression.) There are a lot of good people here as well as
most other ngs. I wouldn't take anything personally.

I applaud you for not "taking the bait" and participating in
another war thread. Except for the user name, you came out the bigger
one. If you continue to experience problems with some of your pens, if
you email me, I'd be happy to walk you through a simple five step
diagnostic procedure to determine what may be ailing the two of your
pens. It is usually better but perhaps not easier to modify the pen
rather than fool around with the inks.

-Calvin



Finally, a friendly, decent reply.

On Thu, 1 Jun 2006 14:48:55 -0400, -Moonstone- wrote:

So the ink dried 2 of my 5 pens out. I know about it and will take
reasonable steps to preventing it from happening again. It wasn't one
of my pens that was damaged. You'll need to talk to the guy over at
Pens-More and get those details. I don't know this guy any more than
you know me. It is likely that the regulars of this ng know Travis a
whole lot better than I. Does anyone here care to offer references for
Travis at Pens-More? In dealing with him from day to day, has anyone
found him to be honest and reliable or something less? Is he or is he
not considered an "expert" by his peers? I have been using FPs all my
life but I am hardly an expert to explain how or why something may or
may not have happened. Unless someone tells me that Travis has a
character disorder, I'll give him the benefit of doubt. Am I willing
to take a chance and try Noodler's in my new Pelly? Based on what
everyone in here has said, the answer is an unequivocal yes. Beyond
that, I can not offer up any more.

Drying out can happen. The residue that's left is water-soluble and should
flush out without too much difficulty. I would regard it as something to
be aware of rather than a serious problem, which I think is the conclusion
you've come to yourself.

As regards Travis's pen, all I can say is point noted. Unless Travis makes
a report himself or submits the nib to someone who has the expertise to
determine what chemical process caused it to be damaged, it remains a
mystery.

I can't add to the advice you've been given about Noodler's ink. It has
only recently become available in Britain and as I already have several
lifetimes' supply of ink...

We're getting ready to storm and I need to tie a boat down. L8r Sem.

Hope that works out all right for you.


--
Sem

For some reason my previous posting is out of sequence. It should
follow Calvin Romanoff's first posting. Ciao, virgilio