Fine Pen that is refillable

Dear NG,

I don't collect pen or pencils and I have never posted in this newsgroup
before. But I have a question that probably people here may be able to
answer. I am an art hobbyist and I write very small. There are very few
pens that satisfy me, in fact throughout my life I have had only two
kinds that earned my full satisfaction. My criterion are simple but
unfortunately hard to satisfy..

1. The pen should write 5-4mm
2. The pen should not blot if remained long on the paper.

It's crazy but most pen that claim they are 5mm aren't actually 5mm and
if they are, they always blot when you place them long on the paper. The
best that satisfy this 2 condition are ballpoint pen with precision (I
would be surprised and maybe pleased if I learn that there are fountain
pens that does this.. even if they are, I don't suppose they can fit in
the holes of templates used by architects). It is ironic but those that
really satisfied me where among the cheapest of the kind (one pen around
25 cents!), but very hard to find.. well at least for me who lives now
in Germany.

When I used to live in Asia, I could easily get this Mitsubishi spring
ballpoint pen (with replaceable filler). But now that I'm in Germany I
can't find them in whatever bookstore/stationary shop I search. The
Mitsubish pen was the first pen that satisfied my criterion. While I was
staying here I suddenly happened to meet someone with a pen (I always
try people's pen if I get the chance..) that had also this good
quality... unfortunately this pen he had was from Ukraine, I think it is
sold only in Russian stationary shops, it has the trademark "PENSAN
Global 5mm" (and it's even cheaper than the Mitsubishi).

Could someone perhaps refer to me to a German made pen (and probably a
place where I can order it) which is not so expensive and that helps me
with my work? I have seen many architectural, art .. etc. pens by
Rottring and Staedler but most of them aren't good enough.

Many thanks in advance.

Sincerely,
Jose Capco

"Jose Capco" wrote:

Dear NG,

I don't collect pen or pencils and I have never posted in this newsgroup
before. But I have a question that probably people here may be able to
answer. I am an art hobbyist and I write very small. There are very few
pens that satisfy me, in fact throughout my life I have had only two kinds
that earned my full satisfaction. My criterion are simple but
unfortunately hard to satisfy..

1. The pen should write 5-4mm
2. The pen should not blot if remained long on the paper.

It's crazy but most pen that claim they are 5mm aren't actually 5mm and if
they are, they always blot when you place them long on the paper. The best
that satisfy this 2 condition are ballpoint pen with precision (I would be
surprised and maybe pleased if I learn that there are fountain pens that
does this.. even if they are, I don't suppose they can fit in the holes of
templates used by architects). It is ironic but those that really
satisfied me where among the cheapest of the kind (one pen around 25
cents!), but very hard to find.. well at least for me who lives now in
Germany.

When I used to live in Asia, I could easily get this Mitsubishi spring
ballpoint pen (with replaceable filler). But now that I'm in Germany I
can't find them in whatever bookstore/stationary shop I search. The
Mitsubish pen was the first pen that satisfied my criterion. While I was
staying here I suddenly happened to meet someone with a pen (I always try
people's pen if I get the chance..) that had also this good quality...
unfortunately this pen he had was from Ukraine, I think it is sold only in
Russian stationary shops, it has the trademark "PENSAN Global 5mm" (and
it's even cheaper than the Mitsubishi).

Could someone perhaps refer to me to a German made pen (and probably a
place where I can order it) which is not so expensive and that helps me
with my work? I have seen many architectural, art .. etc. pens by Rottring
and Staedler but most of them aren't good enough.

Well, it's not German. But the BIC orange stic fine point meets your
requirements to a T. Comes in blue and black and even other colours in
Europe. You might also want to see if you can find a fine point M10.

People look down on BICs. They really shouldn't.

And it's 0.5 MM, not 5 MM. 5 MM would be very, very broad indeed!

john cline ii, admirer and user of Bic Fine Stics!

john cline ii wrote:
Well, it's not German. But the BIC orange stic fine point meets your
requirements to a T. Comes in blue and black and even other colours in
Europe. You might also want to see if you can find a fine point M10.

People look down on BICs. They really shouldn't.

And it's 0.5 MM, not 5 MM. 5 MM would be very, very broad indeed!

john cline ii, admirer and user of Bic Fine Stics!


Hi,

Thanks for the reply.. and sorry, yes I meant 0.5mm of course. I have
tried a lot of BICs, but I have to say that it were all bad for me.
There is one thing of BIC that I like though, and that is the almost
frictionless roll of the ball. But I will however try the BIC you
mentioned, I don't know where to find it and I am not sure what exactly
this "orange stic fine point" is. Are you talking about this:

http://www.fmi.uni-passau.de/~capco/bic.jpg

I think I tried that one in the past. But I am not yet sure. I can be
convinced once I see the tip of the pen (I have acquired a lot of
experience through my pen-shopping that I can tell if a pen really
writes at .5mm without blotting if I look at the tip carefully). Most
pens that have brass-colored tips do not tend to meet my requirements.

Here is a pen

http://www.fmi.uni-passau.de/~capco/pensan1.jpg

that meets the requirement. (Notice that the tip is so much marked with
ink blots.. and the case is almost broken.. this is not because the pen
was bad.. but because I have "manually" refilled the pen dozen of times
just because I couldn't get my hand on a pen similar to this one).

I will explain with more detail on how one can say that this pen is
good. If you consider the tip to be like a cone, then the pen is usually
good if it has a slope that is *lower* than most pens! Lower slope means
that the base of the cone must be much much smaller in comaprison to
it's height, and that the very tip has at most .5mm radius. The picture
of the pen in the link above has this property.

If it's not difficult for you to make a zoomed photo of the tip and
probably another photo of the body (to make sure I get the right pen)
then I think I will be able to know what to buy.

Here is another photo of Pensan
http://www.fmi.uni-passau.de/~capco/pensan2.jpg

I have not seen any other pen except the mitsubishi that are as good for
me. I will be overjoyed if BIC or any other pen can help me.

Sincerely,
Jose Capco

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 10:22:25 +0100, Jose Capco
wrote:

Dear NG,

I don't collect pen or pencils and I have never posted in this newsgroup
before. But I have a question that probably people here may be able to
answer. I am an art hobbyist and I write very small. There are very few
pens that satisfy me, in fact throughout my life I have had only two
kinds that earned my full satisfaction. My criterion are simple but
unfortunately hard to satisfy..

1. The pen should write 5-4mm
2. The pen should not blot if remained long on the paper.



Have you tried the Caran d'Ache Office Series?
http://www.pencity.com/cgi-bin/SoftC...887+1100580993

Price is not bad, and the refils are reasonable. Should be easy to get
in Germany.

Also any FABER-CASTELL (uses Parker Style refil) are good writers.

Jose Capco wrote in message ...
john cline ii wrote:
Well, it's not German. But the BIC orange stic fine point meets your
requirements to a T. Comes in blue and black and even other colours in
Europe. You might also want to see if you can find a fine point M10.

People look down on BICs. They really shouldn't.

And it's 0.5 MM, not 5 MM. 5 MM would be very, very broad indeed!

john cline ii, admirer and user of Bic Fine Stics!


Hi,

Thanks for the reply.. and sorry, yes I meant 0.5mm of course. I have
tried a lot of BICs, but I have to say that it were all bad for me.
There is one thing of BIC that I like though, and that is the almost
frictionless roll of the ball. But I will however try the BIC you
mentioned, I don't know where to find it and I am not sure what exactly
this "orange stic fine point" is. Are you talking about this:

----------SNIP----------

For some reason, all the BIC brand fine points come in orange barrels
(nothing to do with someone's hair). Their mediums are either the
clear plastic barrels, six-sided, or trhe nnewer round with white
barrel. In all cases, the cap color indicates ink color.

But watch out for jcII -- I think he owns stock in the company. ;-Q

r&d

"Jose Capco" wrote in message
...

[snip]


I have not seen any other pen except the mitsubishi that are as good for
me. I will be overjoyed if BIC or any other pen can help me.

Sincerely,
Jose Capco

Hi there,

Have you tried these:
http://www.staedtler.de/e4wstaedtler.../eng/home.nsf/

Check out the Mars ® professional 712


--
Best regards,
T-H Lim
(aka Free Citizen)
Fountain Pen Network
A pen site run by the Pen Community
http://pagesperso.laposte.net/fpnet
Short Domain Name: fpforum.tk

Free Citizen wrote:
Hi there,

Have you tried these:
http://www.staedtler.de/e4wstaedtler.../eng/home.nsf/

Check out the Mars ® professional 712



Hi there,

I haven't tried Mars professional 712. I will go and see it once I set
my foot on a big stationary shop (I don't suppose they are available on
my local small shop).

But here is a simple question : If I set the pen on a paper for 2
second, how big will the .35mm become? I need at most a
1000-500millisecond time for a good pen to have at most a .6mm mark.

Thanks for the suggestions.

Sincerely,
Jose Capco

Jose Capco wrote:

... If I set the pen on a paper for 2 second,
how big will the .35mm become? I need at
most a 1000-500millisecond time for a good
pen to have at most a .6mm mark.

Both conditions are "at most." Shouldn't the
time constraint be "at least?" Aren't you trying
to limit the expansion?

Why ask about "2 seconds" then specify a
test of 1/2 to 1 second? You gotta make up
your mind and state it plainly.

Also, trying to set conditions for a test by
specifying only one of the two interacting
variables is fruitless, isn't it? What kind of
paper would you like this .6mm mark to
be created on?

Almost makes me believe this whole thing
is a joke, especially when I look at the
posted photos of that old POS pen that
looks like it was run over by a Yugo.