Idea to eliminate high denomination banknotes in Norway

http://www.aftenposten.no/english/lo...cle1103567.ece

In article . com,
stonej wrote:

http://www.aftenposten.no/english/lo...cle1103567.ece

From the article:

Cash is the goal and medium for everything from drug trafficking, to
gambling to blackmail, Woxholt said...

"Let us make it as impractical and elaborate as possible to pay by
cash," Woxholt said.

What an ass.

Paul

--
Paul Anderson
OpenVMS Engineering
Hewlett-Packard Company

Sounds like a good idea, except for the suggestion for minting high
denomination coins. Paul Anderson's comment is negative and unhelpful. He
should explain why. There are very few occasions when one may need high
denomination notes. I never use fifties or hundreds; checks or credit cards
are much more convenient and safer.

Tony


"Paul Anderson" wrote in message
...
In article . com,
stonej wrote:

http://www.aftenposten.no/english/lo...cle1103567.ece

From the article:

Cash is the goal and medium for everything from drug trafficking, to
gambling to blackmail, Woxholt said...

"Let us make it as impractical and elaborate as possible to pay by
cash," Woxholt said.

What an ass.

Paul

--
Paul Anderson
OpenVMS Engineering
Hewlett-Packard Company




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In article , A.E. Gelat
wrote:

Sounds like a good idea, except for the suggestion for minting high
denomination coins. Paul Anderson's comment is negative and
unhelpful. He should explain why. There are very few occasions when
one may need high denomination notes. I never use fifties or
hundreds; checks or credit cards are much more convenient and safer.

My comment was mostly about making it inconvenient for people to spend
cash. Why would a country want to do that? And why would someone in
government believe that most people spending cash are criminals?

I use credit cards when I have to, but otherwise I like to spend cash.
I find it faster and more convenient than using a credit card.

I wish the ATM would give me bills greater than $20 because it's so
much simpler to buy groceries, for example, with a $100 or a couple of
$50s than dealing with so many $20s.

Paul

--
Paul Anderson
OpenVMS Engineering
Hewlett-Packard Company

Paul Anderson wrote:

My comment was mostly about making it inconvenient for people to spend
cash. Why would a country want to do that? And why would someone in
government believe that most people spending cash are criminals?

Because it is a good excuse to scare people into coughing up a few more
percentage points for shareholders.

If you use cash then it is very difficult for a
bank/government/extortionist to charge you a 2.3% holding fee, a $2.00
withdrawal fee, a 0.6% handling fee, a 1.2% monthly fee, and a general
1.05% transaction fee, etc. (numbers for example purposes only).

In other words, if you are not using credit cards and bank cards then
banks aren't making enough money off of you to please their
shareholders, who are the REAL clients in modern banking. I'm not
talking about borrowing or mortgaging -- just plain old daily
transactions like buying groceries and paying the hydro bill and picking
up a cup of coffee and a muffin.

By making cash a suspect commodity society is forced to pay the extra
little percentages. (Yeah, maybe 5% of the populace use credit cards
wisely but the other 95% more than make up for it.)

Hypothetically, if people kept all their money in stacks of coins and
bills in front of them and actually had to manually give the extra
percentages to the financial institutions, people would freak to realize
how much is being shaved off. If they felt a hand in their pocket
actually taking the fees they may not find it as pleasant as when it is
just a footnote on some financial document. But a digital bank account
is just conceptual and few notice a percent here and a minor service
charge there.

If you earn $40,000 per year and give the banks 3% of every transaction
you make, that is $1,200.00 a year you are letting them take from you so
that you can ... uh ... have access to your money. If you work 40 years,
that is $48,000 in minor fees that could have been a nice car, boat, or
down payment on a house. Instead, that is $48,000 investment revenue for
the financial institution shareholders so they can buy a nice car, boat,
or make a down payment on a house. Pretty sweet from their PoV. $50k for
just letting you access ... your money.

And you don't even notice.

I won't even go into how dangerous ID theft and fraud can be when all
you wealth is floating around as conceptual digits in computerland ...

IMO.


- Sheldon

On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 11:48:56 -0500, "A.E. Gelat"
wrote:

Sounds like a good idea, except for the suggestion for minting high
denomination coins. Paul Anderson's comment is negative and unhelpful. He
should explain why.

Cultural difference. Most Americans would be horrified at the notion
of government making life more difficult. Woxholt represents
everything America isn't, summed up in two sentences: "You (Norwegian
people) are incapable and undeserving of personal liberty. We
(Norwegian government) shall make sure you have none." What an ass
indeed!

There are very few occasions when one may need high
denomination notes. I never use fifties or hundreds; checks or credit cards
are much more convenient and safer.

Old canard. It's very easy to steal money from a bank account. Just
ask the average highschooler. If he doesn't know how, he probably
knows someone who dóes.

Cash is about as safe as anything if you don't flaunt it. It also has
advantages, like "Uncle Sam / Best buy / etc don't need to know who it
is buying all this electronics equipment, computer games, videos, etc.
They can just take their snotty noses right out of our business.

Padraic.

Tony


"Paul Anderson" wrote in message
...
In article . com,
stonej wrote:

http://www.aftenposten.no/english/lo...cle1103567.ece

From the article:

Cash is the goal and medium for everything from drug trafficking, to
gambling to blackmail, Woxholt said...

"Let us make it as impractical and elaborate as possible to pay by
cash," Woxholt said.

What an ass.

Paul

--
Paul Anderson
OpenVMS Engineering
Hewlett-Packard Company




----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
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la cieurgeourea provoer mal trasfu
ast meiyoer ke 'l andrext ben trasfu.

"Padraic Brown" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 11:48:56 -0500, "A.E. Gelat"
wrote:

Sounds like a good idea, except for the suggestion for minting high
denomination coins. Paul Anderson's comment is negative and unhelpful. He
should explain why.

Cultural difference. Most Americans would be horrified at the notion
of government making life more difficult. Woxholt represents
everything America isn't, summed up in two sentences: "You (Norwegian
people) are incapable and undeserving of personal liberty. We
(Norwegian government) shall make sure you have none." What an ass
indeed!

There are very few occasions when one may need high
denomination notes. I never use fifties or hundreds; checks or credit cards
are much more convenient and safer.

Old canard. It's very easy to steal money from a bank account. Just
ask the average highschooler. If he doesn't know how, he probably
knows someone who dóes.

Canard? Hardly. Are you suggesting that it is better to keep stacks of
hundreds at home in the mattress instead of in a bank just because it's possible
a "high schooler" could hack into your bank account? I'd be more concerned that
a high schooler could hack into my house.

Someone steals from your bank account, you're protected by the bank. Someone
steals your cash, you're broke and maybe hurt as well.

I never use hundred dollar bills to go shopping. First, I'd have to go to a
bank just to get some. Waste of gas nowadays. Second, I simply prefer to write
a check or use a credit card for higher dollar purchases. Both cost me nothing
because my checking acct is free and I zero out any charges on my next
statement. In over forty years of doing this, I've never had a problem with
evil high schoolers, foreign hackers, identity thieves, etc., but I have been
robbed of my cash several times.

Bruce

On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 20:08:23 -0400, "Bruce Remick"
wrote:



"Padraic Brown" wrote in message
.. .
On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 11:48:56 -0500, "A.E. Gelat"
wrote:

Sounds like a good idea, except for the suggestion for minting high
denomination coins. Paul Anderson's comment is negative and unhelpful. He
should explain why.

Cultural difference. Most Americans would be horrified at the notion
of government making life more difficult. Woxholt represents
everything America isn't, summed up in two sentences: "You (Norwegian
people) are incapable and undeserving of personal liberty. We
(Norwegian government) shall make sure you have none." What an ass
indeed!

There are very few occasions when one may need high
denomination notes. I never use fifties or hundreds; checks or credit cards
are much more convenient and safer.

Old canard. It's very easy to steal money from a bank account. Just
ask the average highschooler. If he doesn't know how, he probably
knows someone who dóes.

Canard? Hardly. Are you suggesting that it is better to keep stacks of
hundreds at home in the mattress instead of in a bank just because it's possible
a "high schooler" could hack into your bank account? I'd be more concerned that
a high schooler could hack into my house.

I never said or implied that we shouldn't have bank accounts. Cash is
not a whole lot less safe. You just have to be careful.

Someone steals from your bank account, you're protected by the bank. Someone
steals your cash, you're broke and maybe hurt as well.

Of course. You have to be careful!

I never use hundred dollar bills to go shopping. First, I'd have to go to a
bank just to get some. Waste of gas nowadays. Second, I simply prefer to write
a check or use a credit card for higher dollar purchases. Both cost me nothing
because my checking acct is free and I zero out any charges on my next
statement. In over forty years of doing this, I've never had a problem with
evil high schoolers, foreign hackers, identity thieves, etc., but I have been
robbed of my cash several times.

Fine. No one's _forcing_ you to use cash. And this is really point of
the thread: people are being _forced_ into using one option only. By
their government.

Padraic.

Bruce

la cieurgeourea provoer mal trasfu
ast meiyoer ke 'l andrext ben trasfu.

I never use hundred dollar bills to go shopping. First, I'd have to go to a
bank just to get some. Waste of gas nowadays. Second, I simply prefer to
write
a check or use a credit card for higher dollar purchases. Both cost me
nothing
because my checking acct is free and I zero out any charges on my next
statement. In over forty years of doing this, I've never had a problem with
evil high schoolers, foreign hackers, identity thieves, etc., but I have been
robbed of my cash several times.

Fine. No one's _forcing_ you to use cash. And this is really point of
the thread: people are being _forced_ into using one option only. By
their government.


Explanation acknowledged. I certainly don't agree with the radical logic for
essentially eliminating all paper money in the original article. I also didn't
realize there was so much drug trafficking, gambling, and blackmail in Norway.
But then I've only seen Norway as a business/tourist. And there was some kind
of brewery strike at the time, making my visit all the more sobering.

Bruce

A.E. Gelat wrote:
Sounds like a good idea, except for the suggestion for minting high
denomination coins. Paul Anderson's comment is negative and unhelpful. He
should explain why. There are very few occasions when one may need high
denomination notes. I never use fifties or hundreds; checks or credit cards
are much more convenient and safer.

Tony



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