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#1
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Problems with Private Reserve Ink?
I recently visited a pen seller's site that had a note about Private Reserve
inks saying that using them voided the seller's warranty. I've been using Private Reserve Black Cherry in a couple of my pens and haven't noticed any problems. Does anyone have an explanation or caution about this? Thanks! |
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#2
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Problems with Private Reserve Ink?
Was the note at a pen seller's site, or at the site of the pen manufacturer?
I've been using PR inks for more years than I care to acknowledge, and haven't had issues with them clogging pens. I have noticed that some colors do not dry well on certain papers (specifically Franklin Covey inserts). You should carefully read "L, not -L"'s note about certain colors and their incompatibility with other inks when mixed. "Argent" wrote in message ... I recently visited a pen seller's site that had a note about Private Reserve inks saying that using them voided the seller's warranty. I've been using Private Reserve Black Cherry in a couple of my pens and haven't noticed any problems. Does anyone have an explanation or caution about this? Thanks! |
#3
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Problems with Private Reserve Ink?
Bernie Schmitt wrote:
Was the note at a pen seller's site, or at the site of the pen manufacturer? The warning appears on Rick Propas's site. http://www.angelfire.com/mac/penguin0/ I would suggest that if the OP has a question about Rick's policy he ask Rick directly. Rick refurbishes and also sells vintage pens (particularly old Pelikans). I'm sure Rick has his reasons for adopting such a policy. If someone else is posting a similar warning, I'd definitely want to ask them directly. I've been using PR inks for more years than I care to acknowledge Geez, this makes it sound like they've been making ink for decades. Actually, Private Reserve is very new to the business. I remember when they were introduced... late 1990s... maybe '98 or '99. Perhaps there's a difference in our respective ages, but 7 or 8 years doesn't seem long ago to me (unfortunately). Noodler's is newer yet. Compared with companies like Herbin which has been making ink for 300+ years or Pelikan which has been making ink for about 168 years Private Reserve and Noodler's are still very young indeed. Even Sheaffer Skrip (1922) and Parker Quink (1931) have been around for decades. -- B |
#4
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Problems with Private Reserve Ink?
On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 03:12:19 -0500, Argent typed:
I recently visited a pen seller's site that had a note about Private Reserve inks saying that using them voided the seller's warranty. I've been using Private Reserve Black Cherry in a couple of my pens and haven't noticed any problems. Does anyone have an explanation or caution about this? Thanks! No problems, and I've used PR in five daily writer-rotation pens for the past three years or so; Herbin in the others. Nope, no problems at all. I'd ask the seller directly what problems he's found... -- Cordially, S. Dasara 12/30/2005 3:21:28 PM |
#5
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Problems with Private Reserve Ink?
BL wrote:
"Sheaffer Skrip (1922) and Parker Quink (1931) have been around for decades." No. The brand names have been around for decades, but you cannot assert that the Skrip you buy today is in any way related to the original Skrip. Modern Skrip is outsourced to a different company in Slovenia, a change which came after PR started. Private Reserve can claim seniority on modern Skrip. And Quink? Well, dye companies regularly change their offerings, and ink companies remix to achieve what is apparently the same color. Quink is extremely unlikely to use the same dyes, the same surfectants, definitely not the same anti-fungals, and so on that they used sixty years ago. I would even tell you that modern Quink is much more washed out than vintage Quink, and flows worse. Modern Quink is about as related to vintage Quink as a modern Duofold is related to a vintage one. Sorta yeah, sorta no. Oh, they still use water, so in that way they are the same. Otherwise, claims of reliability based on the decades of existance are spurious. |
#6
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Problems with Private Reserve Ink?
Nick Name wrote:
No. The brand names have been around for decades, but you cannot assert that the Skrip you buy today is in any way related to the original Skrip. Modern Skrip is outsourced to a different company in Slovenia, a change which came after PR started. Private Reserve can claim seniority on modern Skrip. If you assume that Sheaffer has absolutely nothing to say about how the company in Slovenia is making the ink, then you'd be correct. But, of course, the company in Slovenia is manufacturing the ink to *Sheaffer's specs* and therefore your claim is specious. And Quink? Well, dye companies regularly change their offerings, and ink companies remix to achieve what is apparently the same color. Quink is extremely unlikely to use the same dyes, the same surfectants, definitely not the same anti- fungals, and so on that they used sixty years ago. I would even tell you that modern Quink is much more washed out than vintage Quink, and flows worse. Modern Quink is about as related to vintage Quink as a modern Duofold is related to a vintage one. Sorta yeah, sorta no. Let's take Quink Washable Blue as an example. I don't see much of a difference at all between Quink Washable Blue cir. 1930s and the modern stuff, and I bet most people would be hard pressed to tell the difference vis-a-vis flow characteristics, color, saturation, or stain potential. They are very similar. Quink Blue-Black used to contain iron gall which is no longer the case. I find the new Blue Black far more free flowing than the cir. 1930s Blue Black or Royal Blue both of which have a grayer cast to them. So yeah, Parker may have modified the formulation of some of their inks, but Quink was always a mild, safe ink to use with fountain pens, and it's still a mild, safe ink to use with fountain pens. Nope, I don't expect Parker to start making highly concentrated, greasy, smudge- prone inks in a multitude of tooty fruity colors anytime soon. Oh, they still use water, so in that way they are the same. Otherwise, claims of reliability based on the decades of existance are spurious. You have not stated, except in the vaguest of terms, what they've changed. So what anti-fungal agent did they use and what one are they using now? In what way does the modern iteration of Quink Washable Blue differ from the cir. 1930s iteration? How many complaints about Quink (vis-a-vis clogging, staining, coagulating, mold growth, constituents precipitating out of solution, etc.) have appeared on the various pen boards over the past 8 years? How does Quink's track record stack up against the much shorter track records of the new inks? Quink's enviable track record is a testament to Parker's 70 years of experience manufacturing high quality inks. -- B |
#7
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Problems with Private Reserve Ink?
BL wrote: " If you assume that Sheaffer has absolutely nothing to say about how the company in Slovenia is making the ink, then you'd be correct. But, of course, the company in Slovenia is manufacturing the ink to *Sheaffer's specs* and therefore your claim is specious." Okay, I owe you an apology. I meant to have a serious discussion, but in reading over my words I see that I came on too strong. Let me try again. My point is that the ingredients in the new Slovenian Skrip are entirely different than the Skrip of 1922. They are not even the same color. New Skrip may be good and it may be bad, but it could only be the inheritor of 83 years of reliability if it was completely unchanged. My claim is not specious, it is fact. New Skrip and old Skrip are not the same. That is not opinion. BL again: "Let's take Quink Washable Blue as an example. I don't see much of a difference at all between Quink Washable Blue cir. 1930s and the modern stuff." Much of a difference? No, it is not much, but it is a difference. I have a couple bottles of Quink with Vac ads on the box. The vintage permanent green is close but darker, and as is the vintage washable blue. No evaporation, by the way. BL again: "and I bet most people would be hard pressed to tell the difference vis-a-vis flow characteristics, color, saturation, or stain potential. They are very similar." Whether or not people can tell is absolutely irrelevant to the question of whether or not it is unchanged. One is opinion, the other is fact. Can you tell that Coke is changed? It is. Coke used to be sweetened with only sugar. It now has corn syrup. Quink has different ingredients now as well. BL: "Quink was always a mild, safe ink to use with fountain pens, and it's still a mild, safe ink to use with fountain pens." Where did I deny this? That was never the point. BL: "Nope, I don't expect Parker to start making highly concentrated, greasy, smudge- prone inks in a multitude of tooty fruity colors anytime soon." This must be a reaction to the harsh tone of my first post, because you certainly know about Penman. BL: "You have not stated, except in the vaguest of terms, what they've changed. So what anti-fungal agent did they use and what one are they using now?" Phenol, which was classified a carcinogen about a decade ago, so the ink manufacturers started looking for different anti-fungals. Sanford reportedly has an excellent one, which is why Waterman and Parker in have not had reports of SITB. And what ink had the first SITB problems? Pelikan green and black? And why does vintage Quink smell of phenol and modern Quink doesn't? BL: "How does Quink's track record stack up against the much shorter track records of the new inks? Quink's enviable track record is a testament to Parker's 70 years of experience manufacturing high quality inks." Track record is only relevant if the ink is unchanged. Your argument is exactly the same as saying the modern Parker Duofold is a reliable pen because the 1926 Duofold was a reliable pen. For your perusal and enlightenment, the rest of my message is cut and pasted from Greg Clark's web site, which directly contradicts your major points: "Who Really Made That Fountain Pen Ink? I really hope that I don't dump any rain on anybody's parade, but I'll bet your favorite ink wasn't made by the company whose name is on the box! Due to the intensely competitive and internationally diversified nature of business today, very few companies selling fountain pen ink actually make their own product. At this point in time, I can only think of six companies, that I am sure of, that do indeed make all or part of their own ink. The first company that comes to mind is the venerable Sheaffer Pen Co. of Fort Madison, Iowa. They have been making their own ink under the Skrip label since the early part of this century and I believe they still do. However - all of their ink formulae have changed and all of their inks are now made in their facility in Slovenia. Second would be the equally well known Parker Pen Co. of Janesville Wisconsin. They have been making the Quink brand for well over 60 years. However the Parker pens and Quink inks are no longer made in the USA, they are made at the New Haven, England facility. The other Parker ink line, Penman (discontinued), was never made by Parker. It was made for them by Documentel of Germany . A third company that I know makes their own ink is Herbin of France. Herbin has been making vegetable based ink colors since the 1600s. In addition to making their own inks, Herbin makes inks for other companies, such as making the wonderful but discontinued Vespucci Red ink for Omas of Italy. Then there is the Rubinato ink company of Italy. Many boutique ink and private lable brands are made by Rubinato. Seldom do you run accross inks actually labled Rubinato, but most of the store brand and private lable inks out of Italy are by Rubinato. Gnocchi and Colorado Pen company inks are two that come to mind. Next is a relative newcomer to the inkmaker ranks. The American company Private Reserve of Zionville IL has been in the ink business for a fairly short time. They started production in 1994. They custom bottle inks for Bexley and Farhneys Pen Company as well as produce their own line of inks. At last count they were up to about 22 colors! And the newest brand in town is Noodlers ink. These are also made here in the USA in New England. These inks are very interesting and boast such unheard of before features as being truly waterproof and sun fade proof. One ink - Polar Black - will even write well at -100 degrees F! Last count was 30 inks in the line. Noodlers also makes inkes for Pendemonium, Swisher pens and Art Brown pens. With the possible exception of Herbin of France, even the words "made by" are misleading. "Mixed by" would be a far more accurate description of what actually takes place if the company even did that. Those few companies that can claim to make their own ink usually simply blend together several different standard commercial dyes that they purchase from large industrial suppliers. Many of the dyes used are actually intended for the clothing/textile industry. One company that does specifically address the writing fluids industry is the Formulabs Corporation of Escondito Ca. For more information on Formulabs, see the November, 1996 issue of Pen World International magazine. One problem that the ink companies have is that the writing fluids industry is rather small compared to the textile industry. As a result, fashion trends dictate sudden changes in what dye colors are kept on hand, and ink manufacturers may find a needed dye color suddenly unavailable. This results in frequent small changes in blending formulas so that the consumer never notices any change in the beloved product. With this all said and done, I'm sure that it will have very little real effect on your feelings for your favorite inks!" |
#8
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Problems with Private Reserve Ink?
Argent wrote: I recently visited a pen seller's site that had a note about Private Reserve inks saying that using them voided the seller's warranty. I've been using Private Reserve Black Cherry in a couple of my pens and haven't noticed any problems. Does anyone have an explanation or caution about this? Here are the facts: Private Reserve and Noodler's have higher concentrations of dye in them. Ultimately, if you think that is a problem, do not use them. Most ink with red does have a tendency to stain pen parts such as ink windows, and this includes purple, pink, and so on. The general concensus it that blue and black will do the least damage and has held up the best in vintage inks, and I have no argument against this position. If you have an outstanding example of a vintage pen, use the gentlest blue you can fins, or do not ink it at all. If you have a Pelikan 200, use whatever you please. Noodler's and Private Reserve had some problems with things growing in them, but both of them changed their anti-fungals, and reports of problems diminished dramatically. Rick Propas believes that Noodler's and Private Reserve quickly damage pens. I dispute that, but Rick has every right to set conditions on his warantees, and you have every right to disbelieve my opinion. Black Cherry is a great color. |
#9
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Problems with Private Reserve Ink?
On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 17:35:31 GMT, "Bernie Schmitt" wrote:
Was the note at a pen seller's site, or at the site of the pen manufacturer? It was on the seller's site. You should carefully read "L, not -L"'s note about certain colors and their incompatibility with other inks when mixed. I noticed the warning about not mixing those colors on the Pendemonium page for Private Reserve inks. Thanks all for the helpful comments. |
#10
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Problems with Private Reserve Ink?
Argent wrote:
I recently visited a pen seller's site that had a note about Private Reserve inks saying that using them voided the seller's warranty. I've been using Private Reserve Black Cherry in a couple of my pens and haven't noticed any problems. Does anyone have an explanation or caution about this? Thanks! I had a problem with one bottle of P.R. Orange Crush. Sam at Pendemonium advised that this particular color sometimes turns brown, as mine did, when scanned at the airport during shipping. |
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