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#1
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All banknotes to have a 2D barcode?
Hi,
As an interim step to total electronicization of money I believe that 2D barcodes on banknotes should uniquely sign the note, so any imaging network device could tell if the bit of paper was a duplicate, and help tracking. A non-networked device should be able to check the signature, but not do real-time tracking. If your money was stolen you should be able to receive your stolen property when it was handed into a bank. (Or is ownership of banknotes lost upon theft? - uk.legal) 2D barcode technology is well developed and used for example in franking machines. There may be reasons why not to introduce the technology such as to let dollar bills be the currency of corruption. Dave. |
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#2
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All banknotes to have a 2D barcode?
Dave wrote: Hi, As an interim step to total electronicization of money I believe that 2D barcodes on banknotes should uniquely sign the note, so any imaging network device could tell if the bit of paper was a duplicate, and help tracking. A non-networked device should be able to check the signature, but not do real-time tracking. If your money was stolen you should be able to receive your stolen property when it was handed into a bank. (Or is ownership of banknotes lost upon theft? - uk.legal) 2D barcode technology is well developed and used for example in franking machines. There may be reasons why not to introduce the technology such as to let dollar bills be the currency of corruption. Dave. Sorry, I just thought that RDIF tags could have a similar function- if they could be given a unique signiature. |
#3
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All banknotes to have a 2D barcode?
"Dave" wrote in message ups.com... Hi, As an interim step to total electronicization of money I believe that 2D barcodes on banknotes should uniquely sign the note, so any imaging network device could tell if the bit of paper was a duplicate, and help tracking. A non-networked device should be able to check the signature, but not do real-time tracking. If your money was stolen you should be able to receive your stolen property when it was handed into a bank. (Or is ownership of banknotes lost upon theft? - uk.legal) In principle, there is nothing to stop you writing down the serial nos of all your bank notes in case they are stolen. Nobody does, though. Whilst bar codes would make it easier, I am sure that OCR technology can easily cope with reading existing serial nos. There are good reasons for not confiscating money from an innocent end user simply because the serial no is on a list of stolen notes. There are still nearly 30 million pounds of stolen notes missing from the big robbery in Essex a few months go, and that's just one robbery. The grand total must be much higher. Commerce would grind to a halt if everybody had to check each note against a database of stolen ones. |
#4
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All banknotes to have a 2D barcode?
In message , GB
wrote There are good reasons for not confiscating money from an innocent end user simply because the serial no is on a list of stolen notes. There are still nearly 30 million pounds of stolen notes missing from the big robbery in Essex a few months go, and that's just one robbery. The grand total must be much higher. Commerce would grind to a halt if everybody had to check each note against a database of stolen ones. How would the general public check notes given in change, or from cashback transactions, or even from a bank's cash machine? -- Alan news2006 {at} amac {dot} f2s {dot} com |
#5
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All banknotes to have a 2D barcode?
GB wrote: "Dave" wrote in message ups.com... Hi, In principle, there is nothing to stop you writing down the serial nos of all your bank notes in case they are stolen. Nobody does, though. Whilst bar codes would make it easier, I am sure that OCR technology can easily cope with reading existing serial nos. Making up a serial number is a whole load easier, as far as I know, than forging a signed, encrypted barcode. The post is also about forgery. There are good reasons for not confiscating money from an innocent end user simply because the serial no is on a list of stolen notes. So if I got 5K in cash to buy a car at an auction, got the serial numbers, and was robbed, if the money turned up at a bank 3 months later I would have lost ownership? This doesn't seem right, but then again case law is bad law IHMO. I thought that victims (or relatives of victims) of the Nazis got their art works back after proving ownership even if the work was bought in good faith. Commerce would grind to a halt if everybody had to check each note against a database of stolen ones. This is done for many card transactions, even with a low transaction value. |
#6
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All banknotes to have a 2D barcode?
"Dave" wrote in message oups.com... GB wrote: "Dave" wrote in message ups.com... Hi, In principle, there is nothing to stop you writing down the serial nos of all your bank notes in case they are stolen. Nobody does, though. Whilst bar codes would make it easier, I am sure that OCR technology can easily cope with reading existing serial nos. Making up a serial number is a whole load easier, as far as I know, than forging a signed, encrypted barcode. The post is also about forgery. Oh, I'm sorry, I see what you mean now. Something like a 400 digit bar code, with a digital signature. At standard bar code sizes, 400 digits would take up the whole note, but I guess that could be got around. There are good reasons for not confiscating money from an innocent end user simply because the serial no is on a list of stolen notes. So if I got 5K in cash to buy a car at an auction, got the serial numbers, and was robbed, if the money turned up at a bank 3 months later I would have lost ownership? This doesn't seem right, but then again case law is bad law IHMO. I thought that victims (or relatives of victims) of the Nazis got their art works back after proving ownership even if the work was bought in good faith. I think that's the principle of the law at the moment. Unless the goods were bought in 'market overt' they have to be returned to the true owner. So, in principle, that should apply to bank notes too. I just think that with the present system it would make life intolerable. In principle, everyone could carry a little bank note scanner that checks the serial numbers of every note they receive, but that's also a problem. Commerce would grind to a halt if everybody had to check each note against a database of stolen ones. This is done for many card transactions, even with a low transaction value. There's a difference though. The card transaction has to involve a computer operation anyway, so the cardholder's account can be debited. Checking against a list of stolen cards does not increase the transaction time. If you gave the bus driver a 5 pound note and he had to check that against his database of stolen notes that would significantly add to the journey time. I guess that's one reaon why they don't take credit cards at the moment. |
#7
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All banknotes to have a 2D barcode?
GB wrote: "Dave" wrote in message oups.com... GB wrote: "Dave" wrote in message ups.com... Hi, In principle, there is nothing to stop you writing down the serial nos of all your bank notes in case they are stolen. Nobody does, though. Whilst bar codes would make it easier, I am sure that OCR technology can easily cope with reading existing serial nos. Making up a serial number is a whole load easier, as far as I know, than forging a signed, encrypted barcode. The post is also about forgery. Oh, I'm sorry, I see what you mean now. Something like a 400 digit bar code, with a digital signature. At standard bar code sizes, 400 digits would take up the whole note, but I guess that could be got around. Apparently PDF417 can store 500 characters per square inch (I'm not an expert in this area, though) |
#8
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All banknotes to have a 2D barcode?
John Boyle wrote: In message .com, Dave writes So if I got 5K in cash to buy a car at an auction, got the serial numbers, and was robbed, if the money turned up at a bank 3 months later I would have lost ownership? In many respect bank notes are like bills of exchange in which title passes by delivery. A subsequent holder of the note would obtain good title especially if he had given value for it. This doesn't seem right, My point was that the title may have been obtained illegally (e.g. street robbery), so the original holder should retain title. It sounds like an essay for a law student. |
#9
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All banknotes to have a 2D barcode?
Alan wrote:
In message , GB wrote There are good reasons for not confiscating money from an innocent end user simply because the serial no is on a list of stolen notes. There are still nearly 30 million pounds of stolen notes missing from the big robbery in Essex a few months go, and that's just one robbery. The grand total must be much higher. Commerce would grind to a halt if everybody had to check each note against a database of stolen ones. How would the general public check notes given in change, or from cashback transactions, or even from a bank's cash machine? http://www.wheresgeorge.com? ;-) -- ___________________________________________ ____ _______________ Regards, | |\ ____ | | | | |\ Michael G. Koerner May they | | | | | | rise again! Appleton, Wisconsin USA | | | | | | ___________________________________________ | | | | | | _______________ |
#10
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All banknotes to have a 2D barcode?
The ECB are looking into RFID, I think it should have been in place by now.
However, given the growth in credit and debit card transactions, which have overtaken cash payments in the UK, is there much point? Banks dislike cash, there are security risks, reserve issues and the FRB system leaves them exposed to theoretical runs and credit crunches. The banks love the ability to generate liquidity for credit card transactions and all the associated merchant fees. Does paper money have much of a future? Enplanting notes with RFID chips is an obvious bridge technology, government would certainly like to track all possible transactions. |
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