FS: 1813 large cent NGC AU-50 BN

For sale: 1813 S-292 large cent. Broken out of an NGC AU-50 BN slab
(insert comes with the coin), EAC grading VF-35, medium brown, no major
defects. $2350. I can send an image if you're interested. Thanks.

Denis Loring

"Denis Loring" wrote in
oups.com:

For sale: 1813 S-292 large cent. Broken out of an NGC AU-50 BN
slab (insert comes with the coin), EAC grading VF-35, medium brown,
no major defects. $2350. I can send an image if you're
interested. Thanks.

Denis Loring




Just curious (not that I could afford such a coin anyway), but why would
you break that coin out of an NGC AU-50 holder and have it graded EAC
VF-35? I'll admit, I'm ignorant about early copper and the EAC - could
use a bit of edumakashun.

Thanks!

--
Eric Babula
Clueless in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA

edumakashun comin' up...

I've been specializing in early copper since 1965. EAC people ignore
the slab grade. We use much stricter standards, which incorporate
surface quality, defects such as field marks and edge problems, and
color as well as sharpness. Copper can deteriorate in a slab, and in
any event I want to be able to hold and examine the coin "up close and
personal." In fact, the same goes for all of my coins (I also collect
Bust quarters and random "neat coins"). Most of my purchases are in
slabs -- such is the market -- and I break 'em out as soon as I get
them. I don't collect MS coins, so losing thousands of dollars because
my 69 might really be a 68 isn't an issue. I cheerfully admit admit to
being a numismatic dinosaur: I collect coins, not labels.

Denis



Eric Babula wrote:
"Denis Loring" wrote in
oups.com:






For sale: 1813 S-292 large cent. Broken out of an NGC AU-50 BN
slab (insert comes with the coin), EAC grading VF-35, medium brown,
no major defects. $2350. I can send an image if you're
interested. Thanks.

Denis Loring




Just curious (not that I could afford such a coin anyway), but why would
you break that coin out of an NGC AU-50 holder and have it graded EAC
VF-35? I'll admit, I'm ignorant about early copper and the EAC - could
use a bit of edumakashun.

Thanks!

--
Eric Babula
Clueless in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA

Congratulations on being a numismatic dinosaur, if only there were more like
you around.

Come to the UK as we're all like you over here. Billy


"Denis Loring" wrote in message
ps.com...
edumakashun comin' up...

I've been specializing in early copper since 1965. EAC people ignore
the slab grade. We use much stricter standards, which incorporate
surface quality, defects such as field marks and edge problems, and
color as well as sharpness. Copper can deteriorate in a slab, and in
any event I want to be able to hold and examine the coin "up close and
personal." In fact, the same goes for all of my coins (I also collect
Bust quarters and random "neat coins"). Most of my purchases are in
slabs -- such is the market -- and I break 'em out as soon as I get
them. I don't collect MS coins, so losing thousands of dollars because
my 69 might really be a 68 isn't an issue. I cheerfully admit admit to
being a numismatic dinosaur: I collect coins, not labels.

Denis



Eric Babula wrote:
"Denis Loring" wrote in
oups.com:






For sale: 1813 S-292 large cent. Broken out of an NGC AU-50 BN
slab (insert comes with the coin), EAC grading VF-35, medium brown,
no major defects. $2350. I can send an image if you're
interested. Thanks.

Denis Loring




Just curious (not that I could afford such a coin anyway), but why would
you break that coin out of an NGC AU-50 holder and have it graded EAC
VF-35? I'll admit, I'm ignorant about early copper and the EAC - could
use a bit of edumakashun.

Thanks!

--
Eric Babula
Clueless in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA

"Denis Loring" wrote in
ps.com:

edumakashun comin' up...

I've been specializing in early copper since 1965. EAC people
ignore the slab grade. We use much stricter standards, which
incorporate surface quality, defects such as field marks and edge
problems, and color as well as sharpness. Copper can deteriorate
in a slab, and in any event I want to be able to hold and examine
the coin "up close and personal." In fact, the same goes for all
of my coins (I also collect Bust quarters and random "neat coins").
Most of my purchases are in slabs -- such is the market -- and I
break 'em out as soon as I get them. I don't collect MS coins, so
losing thousands of dollars because my 69 might really be a 68
isn't an issue. I cheerfully admit admit to being a numismatic
dinosaur: I collect coins, not labels.

Denis

Thanks, Denis! Stuff I did not know. I really don't know enough about
early copper - maybe it's time to read up some. I do have a few early
copper coins, but I was always more attracted to shiny silver. I do love
the designs of Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cents, FECs (are FECs
considered 'early copper'?)! I have veered from my usual silver
purchases toward those coins occasionally because of the beauty of them,
but then I remember my collecting goals, and go back to silver. Also,
I'm probably not getting good deals, because I don't know enough about
early copper.

Also, congrats on being a numismatic dinosaur! Just make sure 'your
kind' doesn't go extinct! The pull that the TPG services have on us as
collectors is great, and Market Grading and ebaY grading sucks! I,
myself, try stick tight to the Official ANA Grading Standards for US
Coins. I'd rather be considered a conservative grader, than lie to the
people potentially buying coins I have for sale.

So, thanks for the edumakashun, Denis!

--
Eric Babula
A little less clueless in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA

To learn the basics about EAC, check out its website: www.eacs.org. To
see EAC grading, go to Heritage's website and take a look at the
catalog of the Jules Reiver collection Part 1, January 2006. There
you'll see both the slab grades and Mark Borckardt's and my EAC grades
(we did them together).

If you want to have your cents graded EAC-style, you'll have to show
them to someone who knows how to grade early copper by those standards.
If you want to send me images (offline; send to ) I'll
be happy to take a shot at it, but EAC grading should really be done in
person.

Denis


e wrote:
In article om, "Denis Loring" wrote:


edumakashun comin' up...

I've been specializing in early copper since 1965. EAC people ignore
the slab grade. We use much stricter standards, which incorporate
surface quality, defects such as field marks and edge problems, and
color as well as sharpness. Copper can deteriorate in a slab, and in
any event I want to be able to hold and examine the coin "up close and
personal." In fact, the same goes for all of my coins (I also collect
Bust quarters and random "neat coins"). Most of my purchases are in
slabs -- such is the market -- and I break 'em out as soon as I get
them. I don't collect MS coins, so losing thousands of dollars because
my 69 might really be a 68 isn't an issue. I cheerfully admit admit to
being a numismatic dinosaur: I collect coins, not labels.

Denis



contact info for eac? i like the retro thing.
i have about 20 large cents, none slabbed and would like to
learn eac's grading.

"Denis Loring" wrote in
oups.com:

To learn the basics about EAC, check out its website: www.eacs.org.
To see EAC grading, go to Heritage's website and take a look at
the catalog of the Jules Reiver collection Part 1, January 2006.
There you'll see both the slab grades and Mark Borckardt's and my
EAC grades (we did them together).

If you want to have your cents graded EAC-style, you'll have to
show them to someone who knows how to grade early copper by those
standards.
If you want to send me images (offline; send to )
I'll
be happy to take a shot at it, but EAC grading should really be
done in person.

Denis

Denis - I have a couple NGC Jules Reiver coins. I wonder how close the
NGC grades are to EAC grades. Looks like EAC has graded most of the NGC
MS-XX coins down to AU-50ish. That's not good for me! I have an 1851
Large Cent (NGC MS-62) and an 1854 Large Cent (NCG MS-61). If EAC would
typically downgrade these to AU-50, that doesn't bode well for my
'investment', now, does it?

Maybe I could try to image these two coins and send them to you for your
expert eye to look at them. Or, if you live in the Milwaukee, WI area,
maybe we could meet in person, somewhere.

--
Eric Babula
Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA

If you go to the Heritage website and pull up the Reiver catalog, you
can find your coins and see the EAC grades. I wouldn't worry about your
"investment" (sidebar: I hope you're collecting and not investing).
Slab buyers won't care about EAC grades. If you tell me the lot
numbers I'll look at the Heritage images, though odds are I'll agree
with the EAC grades in the catalog.

Denis


Eric Babula wrote:
"Denis Loring" wrote in
oups.com:

To learn the basics about EAC, check out its website: www.eacs.org.
To see EAC grading, go to Heritage's website and take a look at
the catalog of the Jules Reiver collection Part 1, January 2006.
There you'll see both the slab grades and Mark Borckardt's and my
EAC grades (we did them together).

If you want to have your cents graded EAC-style, you'll have to
show them to someone who knows how to grade early copper by those
standards.
If you want to send me images (offline; send to )
I'll
be happy to take a shot at it, but EAC grading should really be
done in person.

Denis

Denis - I have a couple NGC Jules Reiver coins. I wonder how close the
NGC grades are to EAC grades. Looks like EAC has graded most of the NGC
MS-XX coins down to AU-50ish. That's not good for me! I have an 1851
Large Cent (NGC MS-62) and an 1854 Large Cent (NCG MS-61). If EAC would
typically downgrade these to AU-50, that doesn't bode well for my
'investment', now, does it?

Maybe I could try to image these two coins and send them to you for your
expert eye to look at them. Or, if you live in the Milwaukee, WI area,
maybe we could meet in person, somewhere.

--
Eric Babula
Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA

"Denis Loring" wrote in
oups.com:

If you go to the Heritage website and pull up the Reiver catalog, you
can find your coins and see the EAC grades. I wouldn't worry about your
"investment" (sidebar: I hope you're collecting and not investing).
Slab buyers won't care about EAC grades. If you tell me the lot
numbers I'll look at the Heritage images, though odds are I'll agree
with the EAC grades in the catalog.

Denis


Denis -

The 1851 is Lot 20483, Auction 390 - NGC MS-62BN, EAC XF-45.
The 1854 is Lot 20597, Auction 390 - NGC MS-61BN, EAC AU-50.

I did not get them from Heritage, rather, from ebaY.

Sure does look like EAC is much tougher on these coins than NGC was!
Yikes!

Now, I don't pretend to be an expert in grading anything, much less Large
Cents, but, I can't understand how EAC got XF-45 from that 1851. Looking
at the ANA Grading Standards for US coins, I'm just not seeing all the
wear that someone must have. XF-45 seems harsh to me. Same goes for the
1854. I'm just not understanding those EAC grades.

Can others view the large Heritage pics? What do you think? I'm certainly
missing something. Time to go to the EAC website and see what I can learn
about their grading standards, as opposed to the ANA Grading Standards.

So, what would/should these two go for in today's market? Good God -
looks like I would lose a bundle if I were to put them for sale!

--
Eric Babula
Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA

I looked at the images. I agree with the EAC grades.
Lot 20483: notice the wear on the top three hair strands, the bun, and
the hair merging with the ear. Brought $204 in the sale.
Lot 20597: less wear, but the "red patina" at stars 1-2 is distracting,
as are the surface marks. Frnkly, some might call this a net 45 as
well. Brought $156.
I don't know what these would bring today. Fortunately, if you like
them, it doesn't matter. Enjoy them!

Denis



Eric Babula wrote:
"Denis Loring" wrote in
oups.com:

If you go to the Heritage website and pull up the Reiver catalog, you
can find your coins and see the EAC grades. I wouldn't worry about your
"investment" (sidebar: I hope you're collecting and not investing).
Slab buyers won't care about EAC grades. If you tell me the lot
numbers I'll look at the Heritage images, though odds are I'll agree
with the EAC grades in the catalog.

Denis


Denis -

The 1851 is Lot 20483, Auction 390 - NGC MS-62BN, EAC XF-45.
The 1854 is Lot 20597, Auction 390 - NGC MS-61BN, EAC AU-50.

I did not get them from Heritage, rather, from ebaY.

Sure does look like EAC is much tougher on these coins than NGC was!
Yikes!

Now, I don't pretend to be an expert in grading anything, much less Large
Cents, but, I can't understand how EAC got XF-45 from that 1851. Looking
at the ANA Grading Standards for US coins, I'm just not seeing all the
wear that someone must have. XF-45 seems harsh to me. Same goes for the
1854. I'm just not understanding those EAC grades.

Can others view the large Heritage pics? What do you think? I'm certainly
missing something. Time to go to the EAC website and see what I can learn
about their grading standards, as opposed to the ANA Grading Standards.

So, what would/should these two go for in today's market? Good God -
looks like I would lose a bundle if I were to put them for sale!

--
Eric Babula
Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA