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#1
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Curious Question on Pen Quality
I don't know anything about fountain pens. I've been reading a bit and
looking at pictures. Here's my question. Is there a nominal dollar amount that you can spend above which there is no real difference in the physical writing experience? I guess I'm asking where is the breakpoint between when you are paying for the barrel of the pen and not getting any bang for the buck in the nib? For example, a Mont Blanc ballpoint refill costs about $5, the barrel may cost the other $180. So if I could buy a $10 pen with a Mont Blanc refill it would be as good a Mont Blanc experience as I would ever get for more money. Why ask the question? I understand you get what you pay for, but I'm not wanting to buy barrels. Thoughts? Thanks. |
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#2
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Prometheus7 wrote:
I don't know anything about fountain pens. I've been reading a bit and looking at pictures. Here's my question. Is there a nominal dollar amount that you can spend above which there is no real difference in the physical writing experience? I guess I'm asking where is the breakpoint between when you are paying for the barrel of the pen and not getting any bang for the buck in the nib? For example, a Mont Blanc ballpoint refill costs about $5, the barrel may cost the other $180. So if I could buy a $10 pen with a Mont Blanc refill it would be as good a Mont Blanc experience as I would ever get for more money. Why ask the question? I understand you get what you pay for, but I'm not wanting to buy barrels. In a roller or ballpoint pen the "pen" is NOTHING more than a refill holder. The quality of writing is dertermined by the refill. Its the same refill if the pen costs ten bucks or 1000 bucks. There may or may not be some difference in balance and feel of the refill holder, but in many, perhaps most cases, the cheaper pen may have the better of those. However your question lacks some logic since you ask about fountain pens then go into ballpoints. Although even in fourntain pens no pen on earth made today, on average, can write as well as a Pelikan GO for ten bucks and many other pens in the 10-25 price range such as low end Cross, Parker 45, Waterman Philias and so on. Many, probably most far more expensive pens won't write as well in fact. Pay much over $25 to 75 for any pen and you are buying jewlery--nothing more. So the final answer is to ask how much you like jwelery and how much you will pay for jewlery. Not for a writing instrument that only serves to write. Frank |
#3
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"Prometheus7" writes:
I don't know anything about fountain pens. I've been reading a bit and looking at pictures. Here's my question. Is there a nominal dollar amount that you can spend above which there is no real difference in the physical writing experience? I guess I'm asking where is the breakpoint between when you are paying for the barrel of the pen and not getting any bang for the buck in the nib? Everyone will put that breakpoint at a slightly different place, I personally would say about $100 for new, modern pens. A smidge more if you're talking Pelikans which tend to be very good writers in my experience. I won't buy a Montblanc again, also based on experience. In my not-so-humble opinion, you can get a really good witing modern pen for under $25. Heck, this summer in France at a department store (Carrefour), I bought a E5.00 Waterman fountain pen, appearing to be a clear plastic copy of the Phileas with a plain steel nib, which is a great writer. I suppose it cost me about US$6.00. Also in my opinion, you could do better with a vintage pen that's been restored. I'm partial to Sheaffer Balances and Snorkels. These are pens from the "Golden Age" and are among the best writing experience you can have. For example, a Mont Blanc ballpoint refill costs about $5, the barrel may cost the other $180. So if I could buy a $10 pen with a Mont Blanc refill it would be as good a Mont Blanc experience as I would ever get for more money. Except IMHO the Monblanc ballpoint writing experience is not that good. A Pilot rollerball costing less than $2 is a better writer than a Montblanc ball point refill, with or without the Montblanc barrel. Why ask the question? I understand you get what you pay for, but I'm not wanting to buy barrels. In fountain pens, you may not in fact get what you pay for. The high dollar pens often perform no better- and may perform worse- than a moderately priced or even cheap pen. |
#4
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Are you talking about new pens or vintage? You can buy a vintage pen that writes well at a cheap price if you don't mind a hairline-cracked barrel, a missing clip, a severely discolored barrel or similar imperfections. The nib could still write heavenly. I think the question is - do esthetics matter? How much do they matter? Do you want a gold pen, a lovely celluloid, an overlay, a plain black pen, or a pen with some imperfections? Do you consider a fine looking pen to be jewelry or a darn nice pen that you'd be proud to own, use, and show to others? The price varies depending on what you desire in a pen. Nancy |
#5
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We're talking collectables here, "writability" sure, but more pen jewelry
and all the craziness that goes into acquiring that special much wanted item. As my youngest: you and your crazy interpret friends with the ink stic sickness. Yes, it's a bit of an obsession and can be habit forming, but certainly much more pleasant than a lot of the other addictions out there. True, it can be distressing to discover that your couple of buck Pelikan Go or Waterman Phileas writes as well if not better than the 1000 relative and edson up ender. It's the ijnnards, nib feeder collector. Body gives substance and aesthetics. But there's more to f/p's than that. Regarding r/b's b/p's and their ilk. You are basically correct when you speak about $2 refills. Look at the gliding well made Pilots Uniballs etc. Bic has a superb new very ergonomic pen out, much as I am loath to admit. At a buck or two !! So why do we spend hundreds of dollars for a similar wring experience. Besides the much overated and overvalued snootiness and snob value of a certain pen company owned by the Louis Vitton corporate brand, (their vintages btw before the exit into expensive mass marketing are far better pens and collectables) you can find excellently made beautiful pens by Pelikan, Sheaffer Parker, Delta, the Japanese Platinum etc and pride of the pack imvho the hand made Nakaya. Take a look at their site and mebers visits to the factory written up at www.pentrace.com All these and most other good pen companies have admirable and affordable fp's. Some more beautiful, cheaper expensive than others. It's become something of a sub culture. Nice hobby though, ain't it. Been to any of the pen shows. That's where you really learn and acquire. "Prometheus7" wrote in message ... I don't know anything about fountain pens. I've been reading a bit and looking at pictures. Here's my question. Is there a nominal dollar amount that you can spend above which there is no real difference in the physical writing experience? I guess I'm asking where is the breakpoint between when you are paying for the barrel of the pen and not getting any bang for the buck in the nib? For example, a Mont Blanc ballpoint refill costs about $5, the barrel may cost the other $180. So if I could buy a $10 pen with a Mont Blanc refill it would be as good a Mont Blanc experience as I would ever get for more money. Why ask the question? I understand you get what you pay for, but I'm not wanting to buy barrels. Thoughts? Thanks. |
#6
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"Prometheus7" wrote in message .. .
For example, a Mont Blanc ballpoint refill costs about $5, the barrel may cost the other $180. So if I could buy a $10 pen with a Mont Blanc refill it would be as good a Mont Blanc experience as I would ever get for more money. If you want a pen which uses a ball to apply ink as opposed to a nib in a fountain pen, I suggest you look at a gel ink refill. I've found the Parker Gel refills to be most satisfying. Smooth writing and a wide variety of colors. They fit in any pen which accepts a Parker ballpoint refill. Those pens can be had for a few bucks for Parker Jotter at Wal-Mart to over a hundred dollars for a Pelikan 800 ballpoint. IMHO, there are some damn nice ballpoints in the $10 to $ 20 range. Sailor makes a disposable gel roller, the Innovation, which can be had for under $2 a pop. Comes in five colors and writes like "butta". As for fountain pens, I generally limit myself to $50. However, having gotten a Pelikan Go, which I can't say enough good things about, I've developed an interest in piston fillers as aopposed to the cartridge / convertor models I have. Seems that good piston fillers are going to reuire me to raise that limit. In terms of how the nib works on the paper, it doesn't make a dam bit of difference. But the piston filler makes it easy to keep the pen filled with ink and the mechanicism in the Pelikan works great. Previously I tried a cheap piston filler by Senator and wasn't that impressed. David |
#7
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"DovR" wrote in part: | We're talking collectables here, "writability" sure, but more pen jewelry | and all the craziness that goes into acquiring that special much wanted | item. As my youngest: you and your crazy interpret friends with the ink stic | sickness. SNIP | Regarding r/b's b/p's and their ilk. You are basically correct when you | speak about $2 refills. Look at the gliding well made Pilots Uniballs etc. | Bic has a superb new very ergonomic pen out, much as I am loath to admit. At | a buck or two !! Ok, do tell! john cline ii, who has been told he has been bitten by the BIC sprite! (And who finds a certain beauty in functional, well designed, well made mass market roller balls and ball pens!) |
#8
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Thank you for your posts. I think you've answered my question. I didn't
want to start some flame war. I realize there is a reason to by an aesthetically pleasing pen. Jewelry has its place. Ballpoints have there place. I don't want to take away from any of the aspects. In fact, it was while I was posting to this group only a few days ago, asking opinions about ballpoints, that I got interested in learning about f/p's. I went out and bought a $6 Parker Reflex just to try it. My original question was born: If $6 buys this, and given the pen is not jewelry by any stretch, then $6 bought the "writing". I wondered how the feel of that pen compared to the nominal "best" I could buy and how many dollars I was away from that experience. "David Heverly" wrote in message om... "Prometheus7" wrote in message .. . For example, a Mont Blanc ballpoint refill costs about $5, the barrel may cost the other $180. So if I could buy a $10 pen with a Mont Blanc refill it would be as good a Mont Blanc experience as I would ever get for more money. If you want a pen which uses a ball to apply ink as opposed to a nib in a fountain pen, I suggest you look at a gel ink refill. I've found the Parker Gel refills to be most satisfying. Smooth writing and a wide variety of colors. They fit in any pen which accepts a Parker ballpoint refill. Those pens can be had for a few bucks for Parker Jotter at Wal-Mart to over a hundred dollars for a Pelikan 800 ballpoint. IMHO, there are some damn nice ballpoints in the $10 to $ 20 range. Sailor makes a disposable gel roller, the Innovation, which can be had for under $2 a pop. Comes in five colors and writes like "butta". As for fountain pens, I generally limit myself to $50. However, having gotten a Pelikan Go, which I can't say enough good things about, I've developed an interest in piston fillers as aopposed to the cartridge / convertor models I have. Seems that good piston fillers are going to reuire me to raise that limit. In terms of how the nib works on the paper, it doesn't make a dam bit of difference. But the piston filler makes it easy to keep the pen filled with ink and the mechanicism in the Pelikan works great. Previously I tried a cheap piston filler by Senator and wasn't that impressed. David |
#9
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Prometheus7 writes:
I understand you get what you pay for, but I'm not wanting to buy barrels. ------------------------------ Frank says that anything over a certain dollar amount is "jewelry." Nancy says that the aesthetic experience is important. I'm more inclined to Nancy's point of view. Personally, I don't find the term "jewelry" very helpful. The "jewelry" to which Frank refers includes how the pen looks, how it fits your hand, how comfortable it is to write with, the heft, if you want heft, and the lightness, if you want lightness. It includes how the pen fills, if you're talking about a fountain pen. It includes the total experience of using the pen. And yes, it includes how others view the pen. (It's strange to me to be in a business meeting with a guy dressed in $500 shoes, a $200 custom-made shirt, and a $2000 suit who uses a 99 cent Bic.) In the case that you simply like pens and want some variety, then it includes the variety of all of those features that having a collection of pens entails, in addition to the convenience of having pens filled with various colors of ink (or different kinds of refills.) For many people, the aesthetic experience with pens is important, just as for many people the aesthetic experience with clothing and cars is important. The aesthetic experience is often not essential to the functioning of the item, but it makes the item more enjoyable to own and use. For some people, the "pen experience" is largely defined by basic function and best value for the price. Now in your case, it may be that you simply have no interest in a "pen experience" outside of putting ink on paper. As you say, you don't way to "buy barrels." Well, one option would be to buy the naked refills and write with those, or maybe wrap some duct tape around them to provide a better grip. But unless you're on a slim budget, I'd suggest a visit to a pen store. Check out the displays, try out a couple, see how you like them. There may be more to the barrel than you think. jim h |
#10
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