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  #1  
Old November 2nd 03, 04:38 AM
Reid Goldsborough
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Default Coin Web sites

One of the positive things that people do here and in other online
discussion groups is share information. Web sites are good for that
too, better in some ways in that the information is more easily
accessible later, more permanent, and typically better linked to
pictures. Web publishing is self-publishing. It's like writing a
magazine article or even a book and putting it out there yourself for
anybody to read. You won't make any money for your efforts, but you
won't have anybody editing or rejecting your work either.

There are lots of good sites put up by coin collectors. One of my
favorites is John Carney's RCC Users Coin Image Gallery:

http://mywebpages.comcast.net/jcarne...ns/rccers.html

It's a way for people to show off their favorite coins and for others
to get ideas on new collecting areas they may not have previously
considered.

Tom Buggey's The Most Beautiful Coins of Antiquity does this with
ancient coins:

http://www.people.memphis.edu/~tjbuggey/beaut.html

Stu Miller's The Stujoe Collection has lots of good information from
NGC about various coin series, coin grading challenges, and other
useful stuff:

http://www.thestujoecollection.com

There are lots of other good collector sites too. The better ones
share knowledge about coins rather than just showing off your own
coins, to help others appreciate their coins.

Putting together a Web site can take time, both in the putting up and
in the responding to queries you get from visitors. In this way, Web
publishing is much more interactive than traditional publishing,
particularly if you get a lot of hits. But if you're interested in the
subject matter, this is positive, not negative.

I did a little exercise with Google, which does a good job of
returning the most relevant and useful sites when people are searching
for information on the Web (the reason Google owns the search market
right now). With the coin sites I've put together, Google returns one
of my sites as its first selection with the following search phrases:

coin appreciation
coin toning
coin pocket pieces
coin fraud
counterfeit coins
Draped Bust coins
Bust coins
Bust dollars
Saint Gaudens double eagles

Several other of my sites show up second or third in a Google search
(when using the search phrases "first coins," "coin authentication,"
and so on).

It's interesting that with some search phrases that have commercial
connections, such as "coin grading" and "coin holders," the relevant
sites I've put together don't even wind up on the first page of
Google's results. For instance, with "coin grading" it's the
individual coin grading services that dominate, and with "coin
holders" it's the coin holder companies. It's a commercial Web out
there, more and more. But this doesn't of course prevent anybody from
putting up a noncommercial site, simply to share information.

If you haven't done this, it's not that difficult. All you need is an
ISP that provides free Web space (alternately, you can use a free Web
host, though typically there are more limitations with this). You can
create the HTML that directs how Web browsers display your pages in
Microsoft Word, using Netscape Composer, or with any of the more fully
featured HTML editors such as Microsoft FrontPage and Macromedia
Dreamweaver (some free Web hosts provide their own page creation
tools).

To create images of your coins, you can opt for anything from a $50
color scanner to a $1,000 (or higher) digital camera (lower priced,
lower resolution cameras work fine for Web imaging as long as their
macro capabilities let the lens get close enough to the coin). And you
can tweak these images afterward, ideally to make them look on screen
as they look in hand, with image editing programs that also range from
the inexpensive (Jasc's Paint Shop Pro, others even less expensive) to
the pricey (Adobe Photoshop).

Fun stuff...

--

Email me at (delete "remove this")

Coin Collecting: Consumer Guide:
http://rg.ancients.info/guide
Glomming: Coin Connoisseurship: http://rg.ancients.info/glom
Bogos: Counterfeit Coins: http://rg.ancients.info/bogos
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  #2  
Old November 2nd 03, 05:11 AM
Stujoe
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Reid Goldsborough spoke thusly...

It's interesting that with some search phrases that have commercial
connections, such as "coin grading" and "coin holders," the relevant
sites I've put together don't even wind up on the first page of
Google's results. For instance, with "coin grading" it's the
individual coin grading services that dominate, and with "coin
holders" it's the coin holder companies. It's a commercial Web out
there, more and more. But this doesn't of course prevent anybody from
putting up a noncommercial site, simply to share information.


There is a whole science surrounding google results (also used by yahoo
and aol searches). I have read up quite a few things and learned some
tricks over the past few months.

The bigger sites (and those are often commercial) have a definite
advantage over smaller sites because of something called page rank
(basically page rank is a representation of how many sites link to a
particular site). A site like PCGS may have a PR of 6, mine has a PR of
4. That means that PCGS is much more likely, overall, to be ranked
higher than my site for a particular keyword...especially a generic
keyword like 'Coin' or something similar.

One of the ways to get around this and get better ranking is to target
specific groups of keywords and put them in your page title (and hope a
site with a higher page rank doesn't have the same keywords in their
title).

For example, my museum stuff is targeted to collectors and non-
collectors looking for prices and general information so I have set up
the titles to be Coin Design - Price, Value, History, and Grade
Information.

That helps get the pages high for searches like Bust Dollar Value or
Bust Dollar Information or Bust Dollar Price even though I don't do
particularly well for just 'Bust Dollar'. I don't reach number one all
the time for each series but I do typically get in the first few links
for each series with those type of searches (history, price, value,
etc).

There are many more tips for helping your search engine ranking (such as
keyword density, navigation structure, etc) but inbound links (Page
Rank) and page titles are two ways that I have found very important.
Page titles are easy and something you have direct control over. Links
are more difficult and take time but are very important too.

--
Stujoe
The Stujoe Collection: Coin Grading, News, Forums and more...
http://www.TheStujoeCollection.com/forums
  #3  
Old November 2nd 03, 08:45 PM
Edward McGrath
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: )

  #4  
Old November 2nd 03, 10:03 PM
Reid Goldsborough
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On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 22:11:46 -0600, Stujoe
wrote:

That helps get the pages high for searches like Bust Dollar Value or
Bust Dollar Information or Bust Dollar Price even though I don't do


I don't know if many people include the word "information" in their
searches for information. It's assumed, isn't it? It's interesting
playing with Google. What's the most common coin related search
phrases? I'd guess "coin collecting" and "coin values." With both,
Chuck D'Ambra's Coin Collecting FAQ comes up first. With "coin
collecting," Dan Hersam's site CoinCollector.org is second, the ANA's
site is sixth, Coin Today is seventh, and the U.S. Mint's site is
tenth.

When you type "coins" into Google, oddly, T. K. Mallon-McCorgray's
site The Coins and History of Asia comes up first. I didn't think
Seleukid, Persian, and so on coins were so popular (they're not,
though there are collectors who specialize in this area). This Asian
coin site is followed by the U.S. Mint's site.

--

Email me at (delete "remove this")

Coin Collecting: Consumer Guide:
http://rg.ancients.info/guide
Glomming: Coin Connoisseurship: http://rg.ancients.info/glom
Bogos: Counterfeit Coins: http://rg.ancients.info/bogos
  #5  
Old November 2nd 03, 10:35 PM
Nick Knight
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In , on 11/02/2003
at 04:03 PM, Reid Goldsborough said:

When you type "coins" into Google, oddly, T. K. Mallon-McCorgray's site The
Coins and History of Asia comes up first. I didn't think Seleukid, Persian,
and so on coins were so popular (they're not, though there are collectors
who specialize in this area). This Asian coin site is followed by the U.S.
Mint's site.


Load up that page. He

http://www.grifterrec.com/coins/coins.html

Ok. now use your browser to View-Source and you'll see the HTML from that
page.

Take notice of all of the META values set. Partularly META NAME="keywords".
Document (web site) indexing technology is changing all the time, but it
used to be that the text of a page was more important. Still is, but I know
all the "hints" that a web page author can throw in META tags (meant for use
by web spiders and browser mechanics) can play a big part.

Nick
  #6  
Old November 2nd 03, 10:38 PM
Stujoe
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Default

Reid Goldsborough spoke thusly...
On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 22:11:46 -0600, Stujoe
wrote:

That helps get the pages high for searches like Bust Dollar Value or
Bust Dollar Information or Bust Dollar Price even though I don't do


I don't know if many people include the word "information" in their
searches for information. It's assumed, isn't it?


My raw access logs tell me it isn't always assumed. ;-)

It's interesting
playing with Google. What's the most common coin related search
phrases?


Here is a tool to find some of them:

http://inventory.overture.com/d/sear...ry/suggestion/

I'd guess "coin collecting" and "coin values." With both,
Chuck D'Ambra's Coin Collecting FAQ comes up first.


A page rank of 6 = links from a lot of other sites plus high keyword
density (and coin collecting in the page title) help his FAQ (also the
rcc FAQ) page out in the rankings.

With "coin
collecting," Dan Hersam's site CoinCollector.org is second,


Site names (ie: CoinCollector.org) containing a selected keyword also
get a boost in rankings.

The way google's algorithm is makes it very hard, and almost useless,
for a smalltimer to try and optimize for keywords like "Coin
Collecting" and "Coin Values" or, God forbid, "Coin". It is often better
to try and find your own niche that is less competitive but still
relevant for your site. JMHO.

--
Stujoe
The Stujoe Collection: Coin Grading, News, Forums and more...
http://www.TheStujoeCollection.com/forums
  #7  
Old November 2nd 03, 10:42 PM
Stujoe
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Nick Knight spoke thusly...

Take notice of all of the META values set. Partularly META NAME="keywords".
Document (web site) indexing technology is changing all the time, but it
used to be that the text of a page was more important. Still is, but I know
all the "hints" that a web page author can throw in META tags (meant for use
by web spiders and browser mechanics) can play a big part.


I think the current thinking (ie google guessing) is that google does
not take Meta words into very high account in its results algorithm.
Probably because it is so easy to 'keyword spam' in meta tags.

I am sure some search engines stil use them but almost all of a site's
traffic is going to typically come from Google (AOL/Yahoo) and MSN.

Another thing about google, it will penalize site in the rankings if
they are doing something such as keyword spamming, hidden text, or bogus
link exchanges, etc.


--
Stujoe
The Stujoe Collection: Coin Grading, News, Forums and more...
http://www.TheStujoeCollection.com/forums
  #8  
Old November 2nd 03, 11:40 PM
Reid Goldsborough
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On Sun, 2 Nov 2003 15:42:43 -0600, Stujoe
wrote:

I think the current thinking (ie google guessing) is that google does
not take Meta words into very high account in its results algorithm.
Probably because it is so easy to 'keyword spam' in meta tags.


Google uses some meta tags but not others. It uses, for instance, the
meta description tag in part or in full (depending on length) for what
it displays as a description in the search results. But it ignores the
meta keyword tag.

I am sure some search engines stil use them but almost all of a site's
traffic is going to typically come from Google (AOL/Yahoo) and MSN.


Currently, this is true. Yahoo, AOL, Netscape, and iWon all use Google
as their search engine. But Yahoo recently bought the Inktomi search
technology, which MSN also uses, and may switch to it. Inktomi, unlike
Google, factors in the meta keyword tag.

Another thing about google, it will penalize site in the rankings if
they are doing something such as keyword spamming, hidden text, or bogus
link exchanges, etc.


According to all I've heard and read, the quantity and quality of
sites that link to your site (page rank, as you said) are weighed most
by Google in prioritizing its search results. Less important, but
still important, are the title tag a sits use (if it uses one),
headline and subhead tags, and something like 100 other HTML, design,
and off-page factors.

--

Email me at (delete "remove this")

Coin Collecting: Consumer Guide:
http://rg.ancients.info/guide
Glomming: Coin Connoisseurship: http://rg.ancients.info/glom
Bogos: Counterfeit Coins: http://rg.ancients.info/bogos
  #9  
Old November 3rd 03, 01:08 AM
Nick Knight
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In , on 11/02/2003
at 05:40 PM, Reid Goldsborough said:

According to all I've heard and read, the quantity and quality of sites
that link to your site (page rank, as you said) are weighed most by Google
in prioritizing its search results. Less important, but s


Another thing. Well, I use yahoo and don't normally google for anything but
newsgroups ...

Have you ever notice how Yahoo's links are all routed back to their own
servers, which then redirect you to the selected link? They're counting how
many times people have actually clicked on a link through them.

Nick
  #10  
Old November 3rd 03, 01:46 AM
Reid Goldsborough
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On Mon, 03 Nov 2003 00:08:14 GMT, "Nick Knight"
wrote:

Have you ever notice how Yahoo's links are all routed back to their own
servers, which then redirect you to the selected link? They're counting how
many times people have actually clicked on a link through them.


Yahoo has done a very good job with email-based discussion groups
(Yahoo Groups), Web-based email (Yahoo Mail), and shopping (Yahoo
Shopping), but its directory stinks, which ironically is how it
started of course. Many key sites aren't included in Yahoo's
categories, some of its "Most Popular" sites are wildly esoteric, and
site submissions to it may never show up. A much better directory is
ODP (Open Directory Project ( http://www.dmoz.com), which in fact is
the directory that Google uses and a number of other search portals
license and use. Yahoo's auction site (Yahoo Auctions) is also awful,
having totally blown the opportunity to give eBay, well, a run for its
money.

--

Email me at (delete "remove this")

Coin Collecting: Consumer Guide:
http://rg.ancients.info/guide
Glomming: Coin Connoisseurship: http://rg.ancients.info/glom
Bogos: Counterfeit Coins: http://rg.ancients.info/bogos
 




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