WARNING: Noodler's Inks

On Tue, 30 May 2006 11:05:05 -0400, Chuck Swisher wrote:

I don't see where there was any "tub-thumping"
going on in my post.

I didn't refer to your post specifically. Look at the whole thread. Your
reply was reasonable and practical. Perhaps Mr. ****-magnet may have
provided such proof had he not been called a troll and verbally bludgeoned
by the Noodlers advocates.

So no, this ink isn't a sacred cow,
but it does put food on the table and clothes on the back of a very good
friend of mine.

That's true of any ink, or indeed any manufactured article. Can we expect
to see the group entirely taken over by manufacturers and retailers of ink,
pens and papers or will the special pleading be confined to Noodlers?

Give me this proof and you can say
anything you like about this ink

I've said nothing about the ink, nor do I intend to. My comment was about
the rush to condemn the OP and extol the virtues of the ink. One may be
forgiven for suspecting the mob's motives when presented with such an
unedifying spectacle.

Beyond unnecessarily repeating yourself - your earlier posts are still
there for all to see - you've contributed nothing to the debate nor have
you in any way controverted my earlier point.

--
Sem

"~s***-magnet~" wrote:

I can understand why there might be
misgivings toward myself as an
unknown. But the guy that had the bad
example of Noodles ruining his
Pelly I believe to be an expert regarding
fountain pens. Unless he is in direct
competition with Noodles with his own
line of ink products, that I doubt, I
would have had no reason to question his
veracity. He seemed like a very
knowledgable reasonable guy.

I don't use Noodler's and have no loyalty to the owner or to the
brand. I haven't responded until now, but I must say that I had a
hard time believing the claim in your initial post. The reason is
that I can't imagine how any water-based ink could *ruin* a
Pelikan nib assembly. At the very worst, you'd have to unscrew
the nib/feed assembly, disassemble the nib/feed assembly (an easy
job), and pop the works in an ultrasonic cleaner. Further, that
any water-based ink could ruin a gold alloy nib is totally beyond
belief. I'd like to see evidence of any gold-alloy nib ruined by
any water-based fountain pen ink. Now, that someone could ruin
one or more components of a nib/feed assembly while trying to
remove it from the pen or disassemble it is entirely believable.
I'm very curious but don't want to pester Travis with a bunch of
e-mails... In what way was his nib ruined?


FWIW, if I were using any heavily dye-concentrated ink (and there
are a bunch on the market), I'd be sure to flush the pen with
fresh ink (to clear the feed channels) and flush with fresh water
more often than I would with less concentrated inks. -- B

"Calvin Romanoff" wrote in message
.. .
Mr./Ms. S. Magnet,

I very seldom have anything to say in public newsgroups but I
find participation as a lurker very helpful. Please allow me to
express my opinion that is neutral and hopefully openminded, based
soley on observation.

First of all, you stamp yourself (or allow yourself to be)
with
a username that at the very least is impolite. At worst, it casts a
negative "first impression" suggesting that you may be looking for
trouble. You explained the reason but I ponder why you couldn't have
taken a moment to temporarily modify it to a more innocuous version.

Secondly, I assume you are a virtual stranger in this group.
In
other words, people don't know who you are or what your motives may
be. There is a lot of "trolling" that occurs everywhere. This is
cause
to be naturally suspicious of anything that may seem irregular.

It is my nature to give people a benefit of doubt until they
have demonstrated beyond a reasonable doubt that they are not
presenting themselves in good faith. You impressed me as a person
that
seemed alarmed by an experience and that you attempted to
communicate
in good faith. I wasn't suspicious because in my 48 years of
experience with fountain pens, I know that under many circumstances,
any pen can be incompatible to all degrees with any ink. One simple
test with ink is observing if an ink beads up on a nib or remains
uniformly coated. If you find the situation to be the latter, it is
a
good indication that the ink may be too viscous for some pens. You
can
not judge a pen by it's maker since all pens have variations.

I believe there was no cause for your credibility or
motivation
to be openly questioned or attacked but I can see where others were
unnecessarily being rude and preferring to bicker rather than offer
help. There again, you have to understand that there are small
enclaves of people that too quickly defend others. Although some of
it
I believe is through a genuine innocent act of loyalty, the
"gun-jumpers" may be "bandwagoning" in the hope of "getting a better
deal" somewhere down the pike. Collecting pens can be a passion, and
an expensive one at that, so although as disingenuous as some may
be,
and biting as they may have been to you, it could offer an advantage
when landing that "must have" pen or purchasing a bottle of ink.
Also
there are certain personality types, sort of the "high-strung old
biting queen" kind that have to pick at everything. No offense
intended, I'm also an old queen, but the more mellow gentle sort.
Please don't leave the group thinking everyone are assholes (please
excuse the expression.) There are a lot of good people here as well
as
most other ngs. I wouldn't take anything personally.

I applaud you for not "taking the bait" and participating in
another war thread. Except for the user name, you came out the
bigger
one. If you continue to experience problems with some of your pens,
if
you email me, I'd be happy to walk you through a simple five step
diagnostic procedure to determine what may be ailing the two of your
pens. It is usually better but perhaps not easier to modify the pen
rather than fool around with the inks.

-Calvin

"~****-magnet~" wrote in message
. com...
These inks may not be the best for medium and/or fine nibbed pens.
I
have experienced drying and clogging of both a Waterman and Romet
medium, both newer pens. Because the higher concentration of
pigment
in Noodlers, the stroke-line looks better when used with fine and
medium nibs but be prepared for problems. Using the same two
Noodler's
inks in a broad-nib MB seems to be no problem with it's generous
ink-flow but I hesitate to load it into a Pelican since someone
complained to me that Noodler's totally ruined his Pelikan and
lead
to
replacement. He didn't say what nib he was using but I heeded his
warning.

Noodler's inks are so striking in appearance so it is very
disappointing. It is certainly an opposite to the more watery
Pelican
inks so perhaps there is a reason.

-T

Thank you for your posting. Are you a psychic or something? You
certainly read my mind and expressed it more eloquently than I could
have. I have no hard feelings against anyone. After reading your
interpretation, I'm kind of sorry for some of those people. If I leave
the group it will be because I got all the info I needed and from some
good advise obtained from some great people in this group, I even
landed a new pen (Pelly) based on good info found here. I haven't
purchased a new pen for about 30 years (a MB) and it will be another
30 before I get another. I don't have extra time to hang out but I
know where to come if I have a new question.

I am interested in talking to you about your diagnostics. I would like
to find out exactly why 2 pens dried out and one got stopped-up while
3 others instantly layed down a good wet line. I'm so happy that you
are willing to walk me through this mystery. I've never had pens dry
out on me unless one got misplaced for a year or so. Four or five
other people expressed good experiences with the ink with an
assortment of other pens so I won't give up on the product. The old MB
simply loves the deluxe blue ink. I think I will keep it away from my
Pelly even though it has a broad nib. It's not quite as wet as the MB
even though they both have broad nibs. I have a Namiki that I'm going
to use the midnight blue. I use different colors/pens for specific
dedicated tasks and two each of broad and medium serve all my needs.
Unfortunately I think the rich colors look particularly good applied
from a fine or medium nib. The volume from a broad nib makes a more
diluted color produce a more attractive mark, at least IMO. Take care.
BTW, my name is Thomas.

Tom (not ****-magnet)

On Tue, 30 May 2006 12:02:55 -0400, "~****-magnet~"
wrote:

Mr. Swisher: Please contact Travis, the owner of Pens-More [
.] He is an expert and (in his professional
opinion) he believes his Pelican was totally ruined by Noodlers ink.
I'm no professional and my pens were rescued without permanent damage
so I am not the one to challenge. Still, I don't always have time to
wash my pens every week or dilute the ink so I will continue to enjoy
your product in my broad nibs. The medium and fine nibs are ill and
the doctor has prescribed 2% formula since cream is too rich for their
well-being.

The majority of my working pens are Pelikans and most of them are fine
points (which are pretty much mediums compared to several other
makes). They range from 150s to 600s (jnot counting the 800 that is
being corrected). Some of them will sit unused with either Noodlers or
Swisher ink in them for months - most write on the first attempt when
picked up. There has been no damage to any of them from the ink and
Noodlers and Swishers is all I use - the Mont Blanc ink goes down the
drain and I use the bottles for the Noodlers.

I can see someone that isn't a pro asking the question and where else
would they ask the question? But when a person described as a pro
makes such a determination, then I find it suspect - not on my deep
knowledge of inks, which does not exist, but from using Noodlers in at
least six colors in Pelikans since Noodlers came out with blue, black,
and blue-black (the only ink I don't much care for, but then, I'm not
sure why I ordered it to begin with).

Noodlers has been consistently better in any and all pens that I own
than any other ink. Period. And I've tried a few and even liked some
before Noodlers. Anyone want some perfectly good appearing Private
Reserve inks of various colors?

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

"Derf" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 28 May 2006 21:52:28 -0400, "~****-magnet~"
wrote:

During the previous 20 years, my pens have gone sometimes ninety
days+
without activity and never dried out. Rather than facing the time
consuming ritual of purging the ink in anticipation of an extended
holiday, I just won't use Noodles ink in my medium nibbed pens.

FWIW, I use Noodlers in a med point modern Pelikan, and it flows
without any hesitation even after two weeks of non-use. I use
Noodlers in a Japanese fine point, and it works very well, but it
won't go two weeks, but neither will Aurora or PR ink go that long
in
that pen.


--
regards, Fred

The book of love is long and boring
No one can lift the damn thing
It's full of charts and facts and figures
and instructions for dancing

The Magnetic Fields

I have an older MB (broad) that will go perhaps a year without drying
out as long as there is ample ink in the chamber. I consider this to
be an odd exception. This pen is also consistantly wetter than I
wouldn't expect from any maker. I'd love to know why pens exceed
expectations as well as behave disappointingly. The others may last
2-4 months and not dry out. A Namiki, also a broad nib will dry to the
point of "skipping" for a while before resuming a good flow. Even the
new Pelican's wettness falls slightly short of the MB and I know the
Pelly is of higher quality than the MB. When I get some time to
furlough the Pelly for a few days, I am going to slightly dilute the
Noodler's and do a few simple experiments using those same two med
nibs and will take notes. Have a MB for 25+ years that by luck has
performed as a super-pen, a "perfect" performer - perhaps it has
spoiled me and I have unrealistic expectations of the other pens,
particularly the Pelly. I'm seeing a lot of favorable reports, such as
yours and I am looking hard for good reason to give the Noodlers
another chance because I really do like all it's other attributes. The
way my habits coincide with an irregular schedule, I really need a
lower maintenance pen that will (hopefully) stay wet for at least a
month and perhaps even six weeks. I'd like for that beautiful new
Pelly to stand beside the MB and both enjoy Noodlers without any
hesitation. Except for myself and one other, all experience reported
has been favorable. A little time shall tell. Take care Fred.

In article , "~****-magnet~" wrote:
i do agree that they're highly pigmented. & it make changing ink
colors quite
tedious. [snip]

I love the heavy pigment. I use a sonic gyrate to clean my pens, a
device designed for the jewelry industry. It does take several water
changes.

i also like the saturated colors. i also have a ultrasound cleaner. perhaps
i'd try it some other time.
my solution is stick with same ink for the same pen (usually in matching
color) for a _long_ time. (except i have no transparant ink nor striped ink
LOL)

bye now,

==========
Pam @ Home

Cort Furniture Rental and Honesty are two mutually exclusive concepts.

"phk" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"~****-magnet~" wrote:
i do agree that they're highly pigmented. & it make changing ink
colors quite
tedious. [snip]

I love the heavy pigment. I use a sonic gyrate to clean my pens, a
device designed for the jewelry industry. It does take several
water
changes.

i also like the saturated colors. i also have a ultrasound cleaner.
perhaps
i'd try it some other time.
my solution is stick with same ink for the same pen (usually in
matching
color) for a _long_ time. (except i have no transparant ink nor
striped ink
LOL)

bye now,

==========
Pam @ Home

Cort Furniture Rental and Honesty are two mutually exclusive
concepts.

Right now there's Pelikan ink in it, from the bottle that comes with
the pen. I'd still like to try the Noodler's and if the pen "likes"
the ink, continue using it. Funny, I coordinate my pen body colors
with ink colors also. It seems the natural thing to do. BTW - I had
an old old bottle of Carter green ink that I bought at a five & dime
store in 1958 and it offered up a nice bonus of bunches of polkadots.
I washed out the container and saved the little bottle. I've gotta
dive into this reader and try to set up my own account so I can get
rid of this handle following me. I sort of cringe when I see it in the
ng. The account and machine belongs to my nephew. It's hard to tell
what groups he hangs out in with a nym like that. Take care!

"Semolina Pilchard" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 30 May 2006 11:05:05 -0400, Chuck Swisher wrote:

I didn't refer to your post specifically. Look at the whole thread.
Your
reply was reasonable and practical. Perhaps Mr. ****-magnet may
have
provided such proof had he not been called a troll and verbally
bludgeoned
by the Noodlers advocates.

That's true of any ink, or indeed any manufactured article. Can we
expect
to see the group entirely taken over by manufacturers and retailers
of ink,
pens and papers or will the special pleading be confined to
Noodlers?


I've said nothing about the ink, nor do I intend to. My comment was
about
the rush to condemn the OP and extol the virtues of the ink. One
may be
forgiven for suspecting the mob's motives when presented with such
an
unedifying spectacle.
--
Sem

Thank you for going to bat for me Sem. I also thank Calvin for his
bitter/sweet frankness. In this climate, I know it can be difficult
for people to express "unpopular" ideas particularly if they involve
certain products. All along I made every attempt to remain
open-minded, there were times when I was even thinking and expressing
positive thoughts about the ink. I had 2 pens that dried-out and one
had a small clogg. This had never occurred before until I changed
inks. Even the nothing was ruined. At about the same time, a
"professional pen expert" reported to me that a Pelican what
permanently ruined by Noodler's ink and I had just purchased a
Pelican. From the personal experience commensurate with "professional
advice" I had warning me against Noodler's and Pelicans, I feel I was
acting in good faith.

I also want to thank Harry, Pam, Gordon, Fred, Robert, Curtis, and BL.
If I left anyone out, it was an oversight and I apologize. As someone
else said, "there are good people in there" and all you guys were very
helpful to me. All I was doing was sharing/seeking information and I t
rust that we were all helpful to one another. Calvin, your advice
played a major roll in my decision to return the Pelly for
non-ink-related reasons.

As for Tetra, you have a catty attitude an portray a personality that
Calvin expressed in his post. Your mention of a crapper reminds me,
your posts are already going into a virtual crapper called a filter.
Terry, I'm sorry that you were so overwelmed by someone's juvenile
handle that the distraction precluded you from offering any real help.
Do you have ADD or something? As for you Billtx calling me a troll,
you jumped the gun didn't you? Borked; calling me a fear monger. If I
have had that affect on you, please understand that I wasn't trying to
scare you or anyone. Borked, you based your unwarranted misgivings on
the fact that I didn't name the person that's Pelly was ruined by.
Although under no obligation, it was still hard for me to give up the
name of the person and his professional opinion that his pen was
ruined. I regret having to give good info that many of you did not
deserve to here. I called your bluff but who is really hurt as the
result of it. Be careful. The next can of worms you force opened may
hit you closer to home. Chuck, shame on you for judging my credibility
based on what I could prove. After successfully cleaning my pens
without damage, you know I couldn't offer any proof of anything yet
your perception of me was based on this proof. I did report the
pen-expert that warned me of your ink. I assume that you and he
are/were friends and he doesn't have a competing ink factory tucked
away somewhere goes he? I've never had ill-dealings with you, I don't
know you nor had I have had anything against you and the success of
your business or the lack thereof has no impact on me one way or
another. Still, your general attitude wasn't becoming of a successful
businessman. If my postings stressed you out to the point that you
apparently reached, perhaps you should find a new "lower keyed"
venture to involve yourself.

As a result of all this, I have learned that it is a good
rule-of-thumb to at least perform minimal maintenance on all all pens
without regard to ink, particularly if I am going to use rich inks
like Noodler's. For many years I have gotten away with leaving ink in
my pen while inactive for 4 or 5 months and only purging with water
when changing inks. This pen was the exception. From this point on,
all pens are going to be rinsed will water at least every 4-6 weeks.
BTW, I gave all my inks the test to see which one(s) kept a coating on
the nib after hearing that inks that did not bead on the nib also
leaves a coating on the inside (similar to cholestrol and blood vessel
walls.) I won't say which one brand on hand failed the test nor what
brands were on hand. I'm not even sure if this "test" is really
reliable. This merits further investigation.

Thank you all for ready through this wordy and probably boring
posting.

-Moonstone- (formerly S. Magnet)

On Wed, 31 May 2006 18:07:16 -0400, -Moonstone- wrote:

Thank you for going to bat for me Sem.

You're welcome. I'm in the perhaps fortunate position of being a pen
collector and someone with an enduring interest in the subject. I have no
commercial interest in it. I prefer to see an open and robust discourse.
That's what usenet's for and we all learn and gain by it.
--
Sem

-Moonstone- wrote:

As for Tetra, you have a catty attitude an portray a personality that
Calvin expressed in his post. Your mention of a crapper reminds me,
your posts are already going into a virtual crapper called a filter.
Terry, I'm sorry that you were so overwelmed by someone's juvenile
handle that the distraction precluded you from offering any real help.
Do you have ADD or something? As for you Billtx calling me a troll,
you jumped the gun didn't you? Borked; calling me a fear monger. If I
have had that affect on you, please understand that I wasn't trying to
scare you or anyone. Borked, you based your unwarranted misgivings on
the fact that I didn't name the person that's Pelly was ruined by.
Although under no obligation, it was still hard for me to give up the
name of the person and his professional opinion that his pen was
ruined. I regret having to give good info that many of you did not
deserve to here. I called your bluff but who is really hurt as the
result of it. Be careful. The next can of worms you force opened may
hit you closer to home. Chuck, shame on you for judging my credibility
based on what I could prove. After successfully cleaning my pens
without damage, you know I couldn't offer any proof of anything yet
your perception of me was based on this proof. I did report the
pen-expert that warned me of your ink. I assume that you and he
are/were friends and he doesn't have a competing ink factory tucked
away somewhere goes he? I've never had ill-dealings with you, I don't
know you nor had I have had anything against you and the success of
your business or the lack thereof has no impact on me one way or
another. Still, your general attitude wasn't becoming of a successful
businessman. If my postings stressed you out to the point that you
apparently reached, perhaps you should find a new "lower keyed"
venture to involve yourself.

Meow!