[sorta OT] Book Customer Wants Do-Over

"The Bobino" wrote in message
ups.com...

Kris Baker wrote:
I'd say that the OP is dealing with a mental case or druggie,

Based on your extensive experience as a psychologist, social worker and
psychiatrist, right?
If you think that every unreasonable customer that shows up in a store
is a drug addict or deranged, you must have absolutely no experience in
retail sales.

Well, he certainly had a better memory than some people.

"The Bobino" wrote in message
ups.com...

Some Guy wrote:
I am stunned! How do you even begin to deal with something like this?

I assume you have a police department patroling your town.
Next time he shows up, call them and they will bring him to the local
psych ward where he can chat with all those nice folks in their clean
white coats!


michael adams

....

John R. Yamamoto-Wilson wrote:
Some Guy wrote (quoting his domestic partner):

He said: I'm the guy who sold you $7000.00 worth of books for
$210.00
[snip]
his value assessment is off by about six grand.

So the whole lot of 'em would be worth about a grand, right?

I wouldn't know. As I said, I was quoting a story from an email list.

Now most of the stuff is gone, but the large sets are still here,
about a grand retail.

If most of the stuff has gone and what's left is still worth a grand,
then the whole lot must have been worth a fair bit more than a grand.

Well, the seller did specify retail. Obviously they bought below
retail, and then there is that intervening three years; while many books
devalue over time some do increase.

It doesn't really make any difference, I suppose. The books are hers
now, to do as she likes with, but I just thought I'd point it out,
because it does rather look as if what it boils down to is this:

Your domestic partner paid $210 for books that she would have been
prepared to pay about $1000 for, given that she could retail them for -
what? - perhaps around $3000, and still has the rump of the collection,
priced at about $1000.

Have I got it right? If so, it doesn't make a scrap of difference, I
don't think, if you're talking law. Legally the books are yours. But if
you're talking ethics I guess it comes down to how that price of $210
was arrived at. Was that his asking price? If so, she can send him
packing with a clear conscience.

An interesting question, to be sure.

Or was it her "best offer", arrived at after ten minutes' haggling?
Because in that case perhaps the guy has some cause to feel aggrieved,
having watched half the collection being sold off at ten times the price
he was offered.

But perhaps I'm interpreting her figures wrongly...

All good points. I'll have her look at the thread and see if the seller
was able to pony up any more details.

michael adams wrote:
"Some Guy" wrote in message
...

My domestic partner is a bookseller, and from one of her email lists
comes the following story, which I found interesting enough, if perhaps
slightly OT, to re-post here without the identifying info:

Just to clarify: this story isn't about your partner but is about
someone she herself read about ?

You are correct, sir.

...


"I just had a guy walk in who I didn't recognize as he had put on about
25 pounds and grew his hair to shoulder length. He said: I'm the guy
who sold you $7000.00 worth of books for $210.00 and I want them back.

This transaction took place about three years ago and as you would
suspect, his value assessment is off by about six grand. I won't bother
you folks with all the details but this guy actually started going
through the section (these were all religious books) and pointing out
all the books that "belong to him.'

I am stunned! How do you even begin to deal with something like this?
I told him we had a solid deal, he accepted my check and cashed it. He
said he will pay me back what I had paid him plus a little more for my
trouble.

I think not!

Now most of the stuff is gone, but the large sets are still here, about
a grand retail. And it is still here only because I haven't gotten to
listing it online. But I am of no mind to give it back.

What to do????"

...

This guy is deranged, has a grudge, and has this persons address.
The context is immaterial.

He need to be dealt with in the same way as you deal with all
deranged people. After taking a long hard look at them, and
assessing what level of potential threat they actually pose.

I think walking through the store and pointing out "his" books is the
sign of someone who's potentially violent.

The problem being that if he remembers these books from three
years ago he'll also maybe remember being questioned by the
cops as well. And have an even bigger grudge after that.

Maybe the person involved should either try and convince him they
have connections with the Mob who are actually bankrolling
their store, or they should move.

When she was selling her low-end books at the local swap meet/flea
market, some customers would approach her with books she'd marked at 2
dollars and say "Why is this two bucks? It says 25 cents on the cover."
(The customer was referring to the original price from, say, 1950 or
whatever.) "How come I have to pay more than it originally cost?"

To which she replied, "Well, that's because it went up in value since then."

The customer might say something like, "But it's old!" or "It's used!
How could it go up in value? I don't want to pay that much."

Her response was, "Well, OK, I guess you have a point. I tell you
what--you sell me your house for what it cost in 1950 and I'll sell you
this book for what it cost in 1950. OK?"

Surprisingly, she never lost a sale from that technique. Usually that
was all it took to get them to buy the book.

The Bobino wrote:
Kris Baker wrote:
I'd say that the OP is dealing with a mental case or druggie,

Based on your extensive experience as a psychologist, social worker and
psychiatrist, right?
If you think that every unreasonable customer that shows up in a store
is a drug addict or deranged, you must have absolutely no experience in
retail sales.


I have to agree with Kris. Someone who'd walk into a book store three
years after selling the books--three years after having accepted payment
for them--and claims they are still his, is deranged. Her story about
the customer in an antique store is similar enough in character that I'd
say they originate from the same social disorder. IANAP, but I think
there's enough history to show that such customers need to be taken
seriously as threats until they show they're not.

Some Guy wrote (quoting his domestic partner):

He said: I'm the guy who sold you $7000.00 worth of books for
$210.00
[snip]
his value assessment is off by about six grand.

I said:

So the whole lot of 'em would be worth about a grand, right?

Some Guy replied:

I wouldn't know. As I said, I was quoting a story from an email list.

Well, sure, but that's the inference; I don't suppose "off by about six
grand" means they were worth six grand *more* than the $7000 the seller
quoted.

if you're talking ethics I guess it comes down to how that price
of $210 was arrived at. Was that his asking price? If so, she
can send him packing with a clear conscience.

An interesting question, to be sure.

Or was it her "best offer", arrived at after ten minutes'
haggling? Because in that case perhaps the guy has some
cause to feel aggrieved, having watched half the collection
being sold off at ten times the price he was offered.

But perhaps I'm interpreting her figures wrongly...

All good points. I'll have her look at the thread and see if the
seller was able to pony up any more details.

OK. Will be interested to hear how this pans out. I've never had a seller
come back at me dissatisfied with a deal and, while I agree that coming back
three years later is a bit over the top, I'm not sure that I agree with the
school of thought that seems to assume that he must necessarily be a
dangerous lunatic. He may be, but I'd like to know more.

I myself bought a high-ticket item from a reputable seller a few years ago
and, examining it with a powerful magnifying lens several years later,
discovered that a couple of repairs had been done to pages that were not
mentioned in the seller's description (and, I think, not reflected in the
price I paid). I never approached the seller, but I think I would have had
some cause to, even though several years had passed.

BTW, apologies for getting my wires crossed and thinking it was your partner
who had bought the books.

John
http://rarebooksinjapan.org

"Some Guy" wrote in message
...
michael adams wrote:
"Some Guy" wrote in message
...

My domestic partner is a bookseller, and from one of her email lists
comes the following story, which I found interesting enough, if perhaps
slightly OT, to re-post here without the identifying info:

Just to clarify: this story isn't about your partner but is about
someone she herself read about ?

You are correct, sir.

...


"I just had a guy walk in who I didn't recognize as he had put on about
25 pounds and grew his hair to shoulder length. He said: I'm the guy
who sold you $7000.00 worth of books for $210.00 and I want them back.

This transaction took place about three years ago and as you would
suspect, his value assessment is off by about six grand. I won't
bother
you folks with all the details but this guy actually started going
through the section (these were all religious books) and pointing out
all the books that "belong to him.'

I am stunned! How do you even begin to deal with something like this?
I told him we had a solid deal, he accepted my check and cashed it. He
said he will pay me back what I had paid him plus a little more for my
trouble.

I think not!

Now most of the stuff is gone, but the large sets are still here, about
a grand retail. And it is still here only because I haven't gotten to
listing it online. But I am of no mind to give it back.

What to do????"

...

This guy is deranged, has a grudge, and has this persons address.
The context is immaterial.

He need to be dealt with in the same way as you deal with all
deranged people. After taking a long hard look at them, and
assessing what level of potential threat they actually pose.

I think walking through the store and pointing out "his" books is the
sign of someone who's potentially violent.

....

Unfortunately the OP didn't actually confirm whether those were
the actual books he'd sold to them or not. I suppose it wouldn't be
that great a feat for him to remember and recognise any sets he'd sold
three years ago, as he went through the shelves.

Ideally the next time he calls - if he does - it might be an idea to
have someone follow him at a distance and check whether he makes a
similar nuisance of himself anywhere else, possibly even finding out
where he lives and having a word with any approachable looking neighbours.
He may possibly be having mental problems and simply not taking his meds.

The fact that these were religious books may also give pause for thought
however. Maybe the guy has been reborn - again - or something. Or again
how comes he had such large numbers of religious books to start with ?
i.e. there might be more to this than just cash and books.

The OP also hasn't addressed the point that they've already sold
the majority of these books in any case. And so presumably these are
now non-recoverable. Unless of course, on his next visit, he starts
demanding these customers names and adresses as well.

Thinking of which, it might be an idea to remove any of "his"
remaining sets from the shelves as well. They might even be
sold through the trade maybe, to any other specialists in the
field.


michael adams

....

Some Guy wrote:
My domestic partner is a bookseller, and from one of her email lists
comes the following story, which I found interesting enough, if perhaps
slightly OT, to re-post here without the identifying info:


"I just had a guy walk in who I didn't recognize as he had put on about
25 pounds and grew his hair to shoulder length. He said: I'm the guy
who sold you $7000.00 worth of books for $210.00 and I want them back.

This transaction took place about three years ago and as you would
suspect, his value assessment is off by about six grand. I won't bother
you folks with all the details but this guy actually started going
through the section (these were all religious books) and pointing out
all the books that "belong to him.'

I am stunned! How do you even begin to deal with something like this?
I told him we had a solid deal, he accepted my check and cashed it. He
said he will pay me back what I had paid him plus a little more for my
trouble.

I think not!

Now most of the stuff is gone, but the large sets are still here, about
a grand retail. And it is still here only because I haven't gotten to
listing it online. But I am of no mind to give it back.

What to do????"

Legally, the lout doesn't have a leg to stand on.
He's simply trying to intimidate you. I would tell
him, "Sure, I will let you have them back -- for
$14,000." By the way, his name isn't Fundoc,
is it?

[Memo from the up-stairs office.]

John R. Yamamoto-Wilson wrote:

[...]

Some Guy wrote (quoting his domestic partner):
Have I got it right? If so, it doesn't make a scrap of difference, I
don't think, if you're talking law. Legally the books are yours. But if
you're talking ethics I guess it comes down to how that price of $210
was arrived at. Was that his asking price? If so, she can send him
packing with a clear conscience.

Or was it her "best offer", arrived at after ten minutes' haggling?
Because in that case perhaps the guy has some cause to feel aggrieved,
having watched half the collection being sold off at ten times the price
he was offered.

He can feel any way he wants to, but he
has no grounds for complaining. If you
want to get anything close to the value
of books you are hoping to sell, you sell
them on the net these days. If you just
want to get rid of them and are not too
concerned about what you get, you take
them to a used book dealer. And that is
not "dealer dishonesty," either. It is
simply the custom of trade. There may
be exceptions (if anyone knows of
any, please tell us about them) However,
it seems to me an ethical used book
store would at least say, "If you put that
book on Amazon, you might get $50.
The most I can pay you is $5, but I am
not going to kid you about what you
might be able to get on the net."
Even so, any idiot knows that when you
sell a used item, it is up you to bargain
for as much as you can get. The dealer
sees his task as one of keeping his
expenses down by not paying out
more than he feels he needs to. But
the ethical dealer will not lie, and in
fact will point out the customer where
he might get more, and then will let
the customer decide. Back to the
main point, only a pathetic loser will
come back later and whine that he was
not paid enough for a used item. He
richly deserves to be told to stop
whining and get on with his life..

[Memo from the upstairs office.}

But perhaps I'm interpreting her figures wrongly...


John
http://rarebooksinjapan.org

Some Guy wrote:
michael adams wrote:
"Some Guy" wrote in message
...



[...]

When she was selling her low-end books at the local swap meet/flea
market, some customers would approach her with books she'd marked at 2
dollars and say "Why is this two bucks? It says 25 cents on the cover."
(The customer was referring to the original price from, say, 1950 or
whatever.) "How come I have to pay more than it originally cost?"

Great answer (below). . The sad thing is, there
is a used book dealer in North San Diego County
who has mutiliated many thousands of (what
are now) rare paperbacks. Rather than
making an intelligent response such as you
describe, he viciously gouges out the prices,
on the front, the spine, and anyplace else
they appear. I have talked about this chap
before ("The Price Gouger"). He is not a
bad sort at all, but -- for a used and rare
book dealer who is supposed to protect
books -- he has certainly done a lot of
book damage, probably because a few
people whined at him back in the late
1970's (after the steep inflation) about
cover prices.

Also, another sort of price whiner
is the one who frets about paying
$30 for a scarce book because he
sees $2 written at the top right
of the free endpaper. AS IF the
fact that some time in its history
someone picked it up at a garage
sale for $2 had anything at all
to do with its current value!

[Memo from the upstairs office.]

To which she replied, "Well, that's because it went up in value since then."

The customer might say something like, "But it's old!" or "It's used!
How could it go up in value? I don't want to pay that much."

Her response was, "Well, OK, I guess you have a point. I tell you
what--you sell me your house for what it cost in 1950 and I'll sell you
this book for what it cost in 1950. OK?"

Surprisingly, she never lost a sale from that technique. Usually that
was all it took to get them to buy the book.

"all mouth and no
wrote in message
oups.com...


Legally, the lout doesn't have a leg to stand on.
He's simply trying to intimidate you. I would tell
him, "Sure, I will let you have them back -- for
$14,000."

It's easy enough to act tough just sitting at a keyboard Palmer.

Faced with Mr Angry, 6ft 6in tall and weighing in at 300lbs
with a broken nose and scars running down both cheeks it
would be a rather different story I'll venture.

"There you are sir, the till's over there. Just help yourself.
Take as much as you want. Oh yes sorry. That's please take as
much as you want!"

Wimp!

cowardly taunt snipped


michael adams

....


[Memo from the up-stairs office.]