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Seeburg S100 Tormat questons ( my first tormat )



 
 
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  #1  
Old April 4th 04, 06:15 PM
Dennis Lavin
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Seeburg S100 Tormat questons ( my first tormat )

Hi everyone, I just picked up a Seeburg S100 Phono Jet jukebox.

I have a question on the tormat system:

When I make a selection,sometimes it will make random selections of
other records. Also wont play the "B" sides sometimes, or just the
wrong the wrong selection.

Sometimes it works OK.

What or where should I start? Nothing has been done to the machine, as
far as I can tell.

Could this be a selection button problem(dirty contacts, etc..) ?

Thanks for any info on this. Dennis.
Ads
  #2  
Old April 4th 04, 06:34 PM
Ken In Texas
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

A great place to start would by Tony Miller's excellent page.

http://home.pacbell.net/fmillera/

Dennis Lavin wrote:

Hi everyone, I just picked up a Seeburg S100 Phono Jet jukebox.

I have a question on the tormat system:

When I make a selection,sometimes it will make random selections of
other records. Also wont play the "B" sides sometimes, or just the
wrong the wrong selection.

Sometimes it works OK.

What or where should I start? Nothing has been done to the machine, as
far as I can tell.

Could this be a selection button problem(dirty contacts, etc..) ?

Thanks for any info on this. Dennis.


--
Ken In Texas
http://www.pinballrebel.com
Custom Pinball Cards, Jukeboxes, Drive In's

"Never ask a man if he's from Texas.
If he is, he'll tell you on his own.
If he ain't, no need to embarrass him."

  #3  
Old April 4th 04, 11:36 PM
Dennis Lavin
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Ken In Texas wrote in message ...
A great place to start would by Tony Miller's excellent page.

http://home.pacbell.net/fmillera/

Dennis Lavin wrote:

Hi everyone, I just picked up a Seeburg S100 Phono Jet jukebox.

I have a question on the tormat system:

When I make a selection,sometimes it will make random selections of
other records. Also wont play the "B" sides sometimes, or just the
wrong the wrong selection.

Sometimes it works OK.

What or where should I start? Nothing has been done to the machine, as
far as I can tell.

Could this be a selection button problem(dirty contacts, etc..) ?

Thanks for any info on this. Dennis.


Thanks Ken, Great info.I'll study it and see what I can find out.
  #4  
Old April 6th 04, 03:48 AM
Ken G.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

The last 3 tormat machines i have worked on all had wires falling off
the contact pin box that rides along the bottom of the tormat .
They used ordinary wire on these that got hard from oil over the years .
The wires are soldered to the end of the pins which vibrate up & down
while moving along . This may be part of your problem .
I like to use the flex wires out of an old speaker that will take the
``ride`` longer

  #5  
Old April 6th 04, 03:16 PM
Dennis Lavin
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I was looking at them last night, and I think I will replace them as
they are a little stiff. Also when the plungers are scanning, there
are sparks @ the rivets as it passes along the tormat asy. Is this
some of my problem ?

I was thinking of cleaning the contacts with an eraser, and wiping
them clean and then putting silicone Diealectric grease on them. Will
the grease harm anything?

Thanks-Dennis.














(Ken G.) wrote in message ...
The last 3 tormat machines i have worked on all had wires falling off
the contact pin box that rides along the bottom of the tormat .
They used ordinary wire on these that got hard from oil over the years .
The wires are soldered to the end of the pins which vibrate up & down
while moving along . This may be part of your problem .
I like to use the flex wires out of an old speaker that will take the
``ride`` longer

  #6  
Old April 9th 04, 03:20 AM
Dennis Lavin
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Just an update, I checked the flex wires, there oK, good connections.
I noticed that about 3 or 4 times the turntable mech unit will
sometimes go past the last record slot( K9-K0) and it will try to pick
up a record(where there is none)on the very end of the carrage. The
pick up arm actually comes up along side the last record slot! I dont
have a book on it yet, so I dont know if this is a adjustment or
somthing else. Dosnt always do it, mabe 5 % of the time.

On the other end, (A1-A2) it seems OK.

The other weird thing is,say for instance, if I select K4, it will
pick up K6 first. Also seems like if I make a selection when the mech
is going back to the right side( towards credit unit) that it will
loose any selections made before it gets to the end of travel .Any
selections made as it is traviling left will always work.

I think I have a Gremlin inside this juke !!!



I orderd a set of cap's for the pulse unit, so hopefully this will fix
some of my problems!

Dennis.







(Dennis Lavin) wrote in message . com...
I was looking at them last night, and I think I will replace them as
they are a little stiff. Also when the plungers are scanning, there
are sparks @ the rivets as it passes along the tormat asy. Is this
some of my problem ?

I was thinking of cleaning the contacts with an eraser, and wiping
them clean and then putting silicone Diealectric grease on them. Will
the grease harm anything?

Thanks-Dennis.














(Ken G.) wrote in message ...
The last 3 tormat machines i have worked on all had wires falling off
the contact pin box that rides along the bottom of the tormat .
They used ordinary wire on these that got hard from oil over the years .
The wires are soldered to the end of the pins which vibrate up & down
while moving along . This may be part of your problem .
I like to use the flex wires out of an old speaker that will take the
``ride`` longer

  #7  
Old April 16th 04, 11:32 AM
Shaun
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Hi
I'm doing an AY160 and had exactly the same random selection issues. I
recapped the pulse unit and it woirked first time from there. I still
have the issue of selecting past the last record but got this tip from
the group

@@@@
First, check the position and adjustment of the reversing switch
actuator (front bottom edge of mechanism base). If the actuator is
improperly positioned it can cause the carriage to trip for the
end-most selection when the carriage is not lined up correctly (i.e.,
when the carriage is still in the middle of reversing direction).

Second, check the position of the Tormat memory unit; it may be
shifted slightly to the left.
@@@@

Good luck

Mind you I'd get the service guide, really helps

Cheers
Shaun




(Dennis Lavin) wrote in message . com...
Just an update, I checked the flex wires, there oK, good connections.
I noticed that about 3 or 4 times the turntable mech unit will
sometimes go past the last record slot( K9-K0) and it will try to pick
up a record(where there is none)on the very end of the carrage. The
pick up arm actually comes up along side the last record slot! I dont
have a book on it yet, so I dont know if this is a adjustment or
somthing else. Dosnt always do it, mabe 5 % of the time.

On the other end, (A1-A2) it seems OK.

The other weird thing is,say for instance, if I select K4, it will
pick up K6 first. Also seems like if I make a selection when the mech
is going back to the right side( towards credit unit) that it will
loose any selections made before it gets to the end of travel .Any
selections made as it is traviling left will always work.

I think I have a Gremlin inside this juke !!!



I orderd a set of cap's for the pulse unit, so hopefully this will fix
some of my problems!

Dennis.







(Dennis Lavin) wrote in message . com...
I was looking at them last night, and I think I will replace them as
they are a little stiff. Also when the plungers are scanning, there
are sparks @ the rivets as it passes along the tormat asy. Is this
some of my problem ?

I was thinking of cleaning the contacts with an eraser, and wiping
them clean and then putting silicone Diealectric grease on them. Will
the grease harm anything?

Thanks-Dennis.














(Ken G.) wrote in message ...
The last 3 tormat machines i have worked on all had wires falling off
the contact pin box that rides along the bottom of the tormat .
They used ordinary wire on these that got hard from oil over the years .
The wires are soldered to the end of the pins which vibrate up & down
while moving along . This may be part of your problem .
I like to use the flex wires out of an old speaker that will take the
``ride`` longer

  #8  
Old April 18th 04, 05:45 PM
Dennis Lavin
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I have a manual on the way! I re-caped the tormat reciever unit, but
it still makes some craxy selections!

I marked the 2 end stops for the mech, then tried to change
adjustment-no help.

I put them back to there original positions( looks like they were
never moved from new) and tried re adjusting the detent switch behind
the motor. The set screw was loose on the switch. I tried it in
various settings, only thing it did was to keep scanning back and
forth when the allen screw was set all the way in, and no matter where
I put the screw ( backing it out) it just selects the wrong selection
like before. Say if I select A2 for example, it selects one record
higher(A4) and so on.

The "A" sides seem to be OK( A1-A3-A5) etc. But the "B" sides is where
most of the trouble seems to be. Makes multiple selestions on the "B"
sides (A2-A4-A6) etc.

I have cleaned the RCA plug and socket too.

Could I have a poor ground somewhere???

very frustrating :-(

Dennis.











(Shaun) wrote in message . com...
Hi
I'm doing an AY160 and had exactly the same random selection issues. I
recapped the pulse unit and it woirked first time from there. I still
have the issue of selecting past the last record but got this tip from
the group

@@@@
First, check the position and adjustment of the reversing switch
actuator (front bottom edge of mechanism base). If the actuator is
improperly positioned it can cause the carriage to trip for the
end-most selection when the carriage is not lined up correctly (i.e.,
when the carriage is still in the middle of reversing direction).

Second, check the position of the Tormat memory unit; it may be
shifted slightly to the left.
@@@@

Good luck

Mind you I'd get the service guide, really helps

Cheers
Shaun




(Dennis Lavin) wrote in message . com...
Just an update, I checked the flex wires, there oK, good connections.
I noticed that about 3 or 4 times the turntable mech unit will
sometimes go past the last record slot( K9-K0) and it will try to pick
up a record(where there is none)on the very end of the carrage. The
pick up arm actually comes up along side the last record slot! I dont
have a book on it yet, so I dont know if this is a adjustment or
somthing else. Dosnt always do it, mabe 5 % of the time.

On the other end, (A1-A2) it seems OK.

The other weird thing is,say for instance, if I select K4, it will
pick up K6 first. Also seems like if I make a selection when the mech
is going back to the right side( towards credit unit) that it will
loose any selections made before it gets to the end of travel .Any
selections made as it is traviling left will always work.

I think I have a Gremlin inside this juke !!!



I orderd a set of cap's for the pulse unit, so hopefully this will fix
some of my problems!

Dennis.







(Dennis Lavin) wrote in message . com...
I was looking at them last night, and I think I will replace them as
they are a little stiff. Also when the plungers are scanning, there
are sparks @ the rivets as it passes along the tormat asy. Is this
some of my problem ?

I was thinking of cleaning the contacts with an eraser, and wiping
them clean and then putting silicone Diealectric grease on them. Will
the grease harm anything?

Thanks-Dennis.














(Ken G.) wrote in message ...
The last 3 tormat machines i have worked on all had wires falling off
the contact pin box that rides along the bottom of the tormat .
They used ordinary wire on these that got hard from oil over the years .
The wires are soldered to the end of the pins which vibrate up & down
while moving along . This may be part of your problem .
I like to use the flex wires out of an old speaker that will take the
``ride`` longer

  #9  
Old April 20th 04, 03:46 AM
Rob
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Hey Denny,
Sometimes the problem is the keyboard, or SELECTOR (the number/letter
buttons).
On a Seeburg, the wiper switches can, over the years, get a build-up
of tarnish and the resulting build-up can result in exactly the kinds
of problems you are describing. In any Seeburg tormat system, there
can literally be about 40 different "things" that can cause it to
malfunction, from a control center that needs rebuilt, to a loose
ground, to a dirty keyboard, to a weak 12AX7, 2050, or 6X4 tube, to
dirty detent switches, to plunger pins from the contact block being
mis-shaped from the rounded toroids, to an improper contact in the
credit unit, etc, etc, etc. The trick is to find which problem you are
encountering and deal with it appropriately.















(Dennis Lavin) wrote in message . com...
I have a manual on the way! I re-caped the tormat reciever unit, but
it still makes some craxy selections!

I marked the 2 end stops for the mech, then tried to change
adjustment-no help.

I put them back to there original positions( looks like they were
never moved from new) and tried re adjusting the detent switch behind
the motor. The set screw was loose on the switch. I tried it in
various settings, only thing it did was to keep scanning back and
forth when the allen screw was set all the way in, and no matter where
I put the screw ( backing it out) it just selects the wrong selection
like before. Say if I select A2 for example, it selects one record
higher(A4) and so on.

The "A" sides seem to be OK( A1-A3-A5) etc. But the "B" sides is where
most of the trouble seems to be. Makes multiple selestions on the "B"
sides (A2-A4-A6) etc.

I have cleaned the RCA plug and socket too.

Could I have a poor ground somewhere???

very frustrating :-(

Dennis.











(Shaun) wrote in message . com...
Hi
I'm doing an AY160 and had exactly the same random selection issues. I
recapped the pulse unit and it woirked first time from there. I still
have the issue of selecting past the last record but got this tip from
the group

@@@@
First, check the position and adjustment of the reversing switch
actuator (front bottom edge of mechanism base). If the actuator is
improperly positioned it can cause the carriage to trip for the
end-most selection when the carriage is not lined up correctly (i.e.,
when the carriage is still in the middle of reversing direction).

Second, check the position of the Tormat memory unit; it may be
shifted slightly to the left.
@@@@

Good luck

Mind you I'd get the service guide, really helps

Cheers
Shaun




(Dennis Lavin) wrote in message . com...
Just an update, I checked the flex wires, there oK, good connections.
I noticed that about 3 or 4 times the turntable mech unit will
sometimes go past the last record slot( K9-K0) and it will try to pick
up a record(where there is none)on the very end of the carrage. The
pick up arm actually comes up along side the last record slot! I dont
have a book on it yet, so I dont know if this is a adjustment or
somthing else. Dosnt always do it, mabe 5 % of the time.

On the other end, (A1-A2) it seems OK.

The other weird thing is,say for instance, if I select K4, it will
pick up K6 first. Also seems like if I make a selection when the mech
is going back to the right side( towards credit unit) that it will
loose any selections made before it gets to the end of travel .Any
selections made as it is traviling left will always work.

I think I have a Gremlin inside this juke !!!



I orderd a set of cap's for the pulse unit, so hopefully this will fix
some of my problems!

Dennis.







(Dennis Lavin) wrote in message . com...
I was looking at them last night, and I think I will replace them as
they are a little stiff. Also when the plungers are scanning, there
are sparks @ the rivets as it passes along the tormat asy. Is this
some of my problem ?

I was thinking of cleaning the contacts with an eraser, and wiping
them clean and then putting silicone Diealectric grease on them. Will
the grease harm anything?

Thanks-Dennis.














(Ken G.) wrote in message ...
The last 3 tormat machines i have worked on all had wires falling off
the contact pin box that rides along the bottom of the tormat .
They used ordinary wire on these that got hard from oil over the years .
The wires are soldered to the end of the pins which vibrate up & down
while moving along . This may be part of your problem .
I like to use the flex wires out of an old speaker that will take the
``ride`` longer

  #10  
Old April 23rd 04, 02:13 AM
Dennis Lavin
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Well- I got my 2 manuals a few days back, studied them and
re-adjusted the tormat asy. Now at least when I select "K0" , it dosnt
go past it any more. Also it picks up the correct "B" sides now, (
A2-A4 etc..)(not one digit off as before).

I used some Caig De-oxit cleaner on the wiper switch in the credit
unit too.
Still makes multiple selections at random. I have also spray cleaned
the selection switches,and recheked the RCA plug. Sometimes it works,
OK, then it gets goofy and does the multi play thing again!

I experemented with jumpering the wiper switch in the credit unit,
didn't clear it up(don't know if it would change anything, but I
thought it might eliminate one part ? ) I guess the next step might be
to check all the micro switches in the credit unit? Auful lot of
connections to check.....

Will keep you all posted. :-) Dennis.







(Rob) wrote in message . com...
Hey Denny,
Sometimes the problem is the keyboard, or SELECTOR (the number/letter
buttons).
On a Seeburg, the wiper switches can, over the years, get a build-up
of tarnish and the resulting build-up can result in exactly the kinds
of problems you are describing. In any Seeburg tormat system, there
can literally be about 40 different "things" that can cause it to
malfunction, from a control center that needs rebuilt, to a loose
ground, to a dirty keyboard, to a weak 12AX7, 2050, or 6X4 tube, to
dirty detent switches, to plunger pins from the contact block being
mis-shaped from the rounded toroids, to an improper contact in the
credit unit, etc, etc, etc. The trick is to find which problem you are
encountering and deal with it appropriately.















(Dennis Lavin) wrote in message . com...
I have a manual on the way! I re-caped the tormat reciever unit, but
it still makes some craxy selections!

I marked the 2 end stops for the mech, then tried to change
adjustment-no help.

I put them back to there original positions( looks like they were
never moved from new) and tried re adjusting the detent switch behind
the motor. The set screw was loose on the switch. I tried it in
various settings, only thing it did was to keep scanning back and
forth when the allen screw was set all the way in, and no matter where
I put the screw ( backing it out) it just selects the wrong selection
like before. Say if I select A2 for example, it selects one record
higher(A4) and so on.

The "A" sides seem to be OK( A1-A3-A5) etc. But the "B" sides is where
most of the trouble seems to be. Makes multiple selestions on the "B"
sides (A2-A4-A6) etc.

I have cleaned the RCA plug and socket too.

Could I have a poor ground somewhere???

very frustrating :-(

Dennis.











(Shaun) wrote in message . com...
Hi
I'm doing an AY160 and had exactly the same random selection issues. I
recapped the pulse unit and it woirked first time from there. I still
have the issue of selecting past the last record but got this tip from
the group

@@@@
First, check the position and adjustment of the reversing switch
actuator (front bottom edge of mechanism base). If the actuator is
improperly positioned it can cause the carriage to trip for the
end-most selection when the carriage is not lined up correctly (i.e.,
when the carriage is still in the middle of reversing direction).

Second, check the position of the Tormat memory unit; it may be
shifted slightly to the left.
@@@@

Good luck

Mind you I'd get the service guide, really helps

Cheers
Shaun




(Dennis Lavin) wrote in message . com...
Just an update, I checked the flex wires, there oK, good connections.
I noticed that about 3 or 4 times the turntable mech unit will
sometimes go past the last record slot( K9-K0) and it will try to pick
up a record(where there is none)on the very end of the carrage. The
pick up arm actually comes up along side the last record slot! I dont
have a book on it yet, so I dont know if this is a adjustment or
somthing else. Dosnt always do it, mabe 5 % of the time.

On the other end, (A1-A2) it seems OK.

The other weird thing is,say for instance, if I select K4, it will
pick up K6 first. Also seems like if I make a selection when the mech
is going back to the right side( towards credit unit) that it will
loose any selections made before it gets to the end of travel .Any
selections made as it is traviling left will always work.

I think I have a Gremlin inside this juke !!!



I orderd a set of cap's for the pulse unit, so hopefully this will fix
some of my problems!

Dennis.







(Dennis Lavin) wrote in message . com...
I was looking at them last night, and I think I will replace them as
they are a little stiff. Also when the plungers are scanning, there
are sparks @ the rivets as it passes along the tormat asy. Is this
some of my problem ?

I was thinking of cleaning the contacts with an eraser, and wiping
them clean and then putting silicone Diealectric grease on them. Will
the grease harm anything?

Thanks-Dennis.














(Ken G.) wrote in message ...
The last 3 tormat machines i have worked on all had wires falling off
the contact pin box that rides along the bottom of the tormat .
They used ordinary wire on these that got hard from oil over the years .
The wires are soldered to the end of the pins which vibrate up & down
while moving along . This may be part of your problem .
I like to use the flex wires out of an old speaker that will take the
``ride`` longer

 




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