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#1
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What is THE Book on Fountain Pens?
For those coming to this thread anew, this is a continuation of a completely
off-topic part of a thread which was hijacked into an ATTEMPTED flaming session by someone who is either called Edward Bonaventure who goes under the name of david moeser, presumably for anonymity purposes (or visa versa?): He had hijacked the thread into the totally fruitless, off topic and non-pen-related question (cleverly noticed by kcat, amongst others, who suspected it of being perhaps slightly hypocritical) of whether OTHERS should use anonymity in their postings. And he didn't seem to know what a by-line (and possibly an encyclopaedia) was. Nancy I am not sure I said in the thread (which you cite, -see below) that I wrote *THE* book on fountain pens, though some who were hitched onto this hobby by being given it have paid me that compliment. I said I wrote "the book which sold. . . . ." (over 200,000 copies the last time I counted, which was actually a few years ago). Lots of people think that *the*original book which got the hobby started was written by Cliff Lawrence although it wasn't without its faults: He was apparently not aware of such companies as Montblanc Mabie Todd or Namiki (etc etc etc). I personally think my first is a great book and should be bought first but that any serious collector can't really do without the Fischler and Schneider hardbacks which are somewhat more definitive. (and Frank's because you shouldn't really be heavily into this hobby in a big way without at least knowing some of the secrets of what goes on inside those pens and how to get them working) However you could be correct in what you assume as I have discussed this with numerous aficionados and no one seems to think that there are any more than about fifteen to twenty thousand serious vintage pen collectors out there world-wide absolute maximum. So presumably there are 180,000 people who think it IS *the* book? Thanks anyway for the compliment. Oh yes, BTW I was one of the organisers from its earliest days with Max and Tony Davis of the first International New York Fountain Pen Show which was held at the Roosevelt Hotel back in the '90s. It had a successful no-junk auction with a professional auctioneer flown in from England (not one of those confusing tobacco guys) , a very large number of attendees, a large ballroom along with initial entrance rooms reserved for modern pen manufacturers displays and modern pen vendors (tables in which were seen prior to, and which cost more than, those for vintage pen vendors, - a great idea which no other show has ever copied, though Washington B.C. comes close); and a generally great time was had by all who attended with the possible exception of the Davises who didn't actually make money out of it (and between two and five members of the, - then, - pen-show-arranging mafia who tried to stage a slightly pathetic 'boycott' which had almost no effect whatsoever on the success of the show but which did do those few individuals out of a great week-end and, in those days, some incredible finds). But as I said, any first show isn't a great financial success: to such an extent that they/we never held another one, plus the Roosevelt was just being bought out by Ramada at the time and was going through a huge renovation program which was a possible reason why the price to us was so cheap: Some may provide another reason: The quality of the rooms which hadn't yet been renovated left something to be desired but I accidentally missed putting anything about that in the original contract I negotiated with the hotel: Sorry Frank (who didn't get a great room). mea culpa. Not sure you are correct about Geoff having ever arranged any show in New York? (It was Max Davis who arranged those regional get-togethers at La Manganette and Abe Goldrich/Murray Hoffman who did it on Long Island in the '80s) Hugo Ripanykhazov "Nancy Handy" wrote in message . .. Licensed to Quill wrote: I wrote the book on fountain pens which sold about two or three times as many copies as all others on fountain pens put together. And sold (in half a dozen languages) to about ten times as many people out there as actually collect pens. being an organiser of pen shows in New York, Milan and Bologna. You wrote *the* book on fountain pens? Which one? It sold 3 times as many as all others, is that including Frank's book? It sold to 10 times as many people as actually collect pens? Does that statement actually make any sense? You organized shows in New York? I thought that was limited to the Zuckers, and previously Berliner, and before that Max Davis? Please feel free to clarify. anon. |
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Licensed to Quill wrote:
The quality of the rooms which hadn't yet been renovated left something to be desired but I accidentally missed putting anything about that in the original contract I negotiated with the hotel: Sorry Frank (who didn't get a great room). mea culpa. Have to admit I always thought of it as entirely Max and Tony's show, but I don't claim to know what went on behind them in terms of organization. Having a few 100 non paying guests in my room wasn't fun esp when I eneded up in the ER as a result. But the hotel and Max and Tony handled it as well as anyone could have and it all ended well. I misssed most of Saturday due to the ER visit and being drugged out. When I recovered and stumbled downstairs around 6pm Max and Tony insisted I join them as their guest for dinner. The hotel took care of the hospital bill and the replacement room (a giant suite) was free. By Sunday I was good enough to do the show, if a bit slow, and a couple pen collectors who were doctors checked in on my from time to time. All and all it was a fun time and has become a classic story among pen collectors. I should explain the 100s of guests in my room were bedbugs that ate me alive Friday nite and woke me at 3am. In fairness I should also explain my room was the only one with the bug problem I knew of and the hotel checked their records and found some hikers or backpackers had the room before me and may have brought em in. I suppose this story will never die... LOL and unlike many stories this one is completely true. Frank |
#3
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Hi, Are you Hugo or Jonathan? I thought I saw you sign both names to posts. It's okay if we go off topic, the group has been rather quiet as of late. And I'm top posting because your reply was long even though I know that drives some nettiquette people crazy in this group! I was under the impression that Cliff's book was the original book, but apparently it might not have been. I have Fischler and Schneiders blue and brown books. I don't know anything about yours and I'm sure there are others in this group as well who'd like to know - what book are we talking about? Since you're here to stay and have been around for a long time, please consider giving us your name. And your book's name too! I didin't know that you were in on that show with Max. Interesting stuff. I had heard that the first NY show didn't make any money. Hearing more details that your provided about that old show was very interesting. That's the kind of "off topic" stuff we need here. And it's really very ON topic and far more interesting to those of us who weren't there. Would like to hear more! When I mentioned that Geoff arranged a NY show, I meant that he did the NY/NJ show, at least I think that's how they billed it for the years they had it there. Maybe not. All I know is I went and I liked it. I know nothing about Abe Goldrich or Murray Hoffman arranging Long Island pen get togethers in the '80's. We had a pen club a few years ago that only 3 regulars including myself showed up to. Now I'm in the process of arranging for another new Long Island Pen Club to start next month and we have about 17 people to start. We'll see how it goes in The Land of No Fountain Pens. Nancy Licensed to Quill wrote: For those coming to this thread anew, this is a continuation of a completely off-topic part of a thread which was hijacked into an ATTEMPTED flaming session by someone who is either called Edward Bonaventure who goes under the name of david moeser, presumably for anonymity purposes (or visa versa?): He had hijacked the thread into the totally fruitless, off topic and non-pen-related question (cleverly noticed by kcat, amongst others, who suspected it of being perhaps slightly hypocritical) of whether OTHERS should use anonymity in their postings. And he didn't seem to know what a by-line (and possibly an encyclopaedia) was. Nancy I am not sure I said in the thread (which you cite, -see below) that I wrote *THE* book on fountain pens, though some who were hitched onto this hobby by being given it have paid me that compliment. I said I wrote "the book which sold. . . . ." (over 200,000 copies the last time I counted, which was actually a few years ago). Lots of people think that *the*original book which got the hobby started was written by Cliff Lawrence although it wasn't without its faults: He was apparently not aware of such companies as Montblanc Mabie Todd or Namiki (etc etc etc). I personally think my first is a great book and should be bought first but that any serious collector can't really do without the Fischler and Schneider hardbacks which are somewhat more definitive. (and Frank's because you shouldn't really be heavily into this hobby in a big way without at least knowing some of the secrets of what goes on inside those pens and how to get them working) However you could be correct in what you assume as I have discussed this with numerous aficionados and no one seems to think that there are any more than about fifteen to twenty thousand serious vintage pen collectors out there world-wide absolute maximum. So presumably there are 180,000 people who think it IS *the* book? Thanks anyway for the compliment. Oh yes, BTW I was one of the organisers from its earliest days with Max and Tony Davis of the first International New York Fountain Pen Show which was held at the Roosevelt Hotel back in the '90s. It had a successful no-junk auction with a professional auctioneer flown in from England (not one of those confusing tobacco guys) , a very large number of attendees, a large ballroom along with initial entrance rooms reserved for modern pen manufacturers displays and modern pen vendors (tables in which were seen prior to, and which cost more than, those for vintage pen vendors, - a great idea which no other show has ever copied, though Washington B.C. comes close); and a generally great time was had by all who attended with the possible exception of the Davises who didn't actually make money out of it (and between two and five members of the, - then, - pen-show-arranging mafia who tried to stage a slightly pathetic 'boycott' which had almost no effect whatsoever on the success of the show but which did do those few individuals out of a great week-end and, in those days, some incredible finds). But as I said, any first show isn't a great financial success: to such an extent that they/we never held another one, plus the Roosevelt was just being bought out by Ramada at the time and was going through a huge renovation program which was a possible reason why the price to us was so cheap: Some may provide another reason: The quality of the rooms which hadn't yet been renovated left something to be desired but I accidentally missed putting anything about that in the original contract I negotiated with the hotel: Sorry Frank (who didn't get a great room). mea culpa. Not sure you are correct about Geoff having ever arranged any show in New York? (It was Max Davis who arranged those regional get-togethers at La Manganette and Abe Goldrich/Murray Hoffman who did it on Long Island in the '80s) Hugo Ripanykhazov |
#4
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Nancy Handy wrote:
I was under the impression that Cliff's book was the original book, but apparently it might not have been. It was by far. 1977. Paperback, not large but many pages in color. Rather useless by todays standards other than its historical importance to pen collecting since it did really "start" the hobby as there was nothing formal before it and within 2 or 3 years after it pen shows, other books, newsletters (mainly Cliff's own, although some others as well) all followed. No book before it. Period. No book after it could ever have the impact of this small book. No matter how large or how well done. Cliff began it. Everyone else followed. Myself included. I don't think its far to complain about the lack of foreign pens in early books. None of the early books gave much notice to non-US made pens. Which was as it should have been for books printed in the US and directed at a US market. As I pointed out many times until the mid 1980s it was nearly impossible to buy non-US made pens in the US with the exception of MBs and an occasional pen from Japan. I never saw a Pelikan in any store in my life before the mid 80s. Never yet in 50 years of looking have I ever seen a vintage Omas outside of a pen show. Such pens have almost all been brought here by European collectors or travelers. Nothing wrong with that, but Cliff, like myself had virtually no exposue to non-US made pens in 1977. Almost no one here did unless they travled overseas. I'm sure Cliff knew about MBs but to not include them in his first book was correct since it was a book on collecting old VINTAGE fountain pens and it was all but impossible to find a vintage MB in the US back then since MBs were also not usually sold here until the 1960s and Cliff's book was concentrated on pens from the 50s back and its main info was on pens before WW2. It never was intended to be about pens of the "world" since the entire world of pens in the US consisted of US made pens at the time. It was a book about collecting pens in the US and it reflected well what the hobby was and would become in the US back then as well as what the average US collector could hopefully find here. Frank |
#5
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Isn't L to Q Joshua Steinberg, author of several pen books?
This isn't a mystery without any clues: go to www.vintagepen.com (singular: plural gets you to David Nishimura's site) which is one of the first pen sites I stumbled upon. Gary |
#6
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On 5-Oct-2003, (PGBarto) wrote: Isn't L to Q Joshua Steinberg, author of several pen books? I believe you mean Jonathan Steinberg. x-- 100 Proof News - http://www.100ProofNews.com x-- 3,500+ Binary NewsGroups, and over 90,000 other groups x-- Access to over 800 Gigs/Day - $8.95/Month x-- UNLIMITED DOWNLOAD |
#7
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wrote:
(PGBarto) wrote: Isn't L to Q Joshua Steinberg, author of several pen books? I believe you mean Jonathan Steinberg. Really? Then why does he keep signing Hugo? Who *is* that masked man? Hugo Icantpronounceit or famous fountain pen author Jonathan Steinberg? |
#8
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#9
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If there really are people here who don't know who Licensed to Quill is, it
may be useful if you could peruse http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=2195443571 This is a blatant advertisement of the type which people seem to like using every time they put some piece on e-bay which is so undesirable that they fear no one would normally see it. So I thought, why shouldn't I use this medium? Hugo Ripanykhazov BTW Nancy we did meet briefly at the NY show when you expressed profound disinterest in my book (which is OK, not everyone has to want to buy a copy and I may well be mistaking you for someone else) but I happen to LIKE top posting because it lets you easily and quickly scroll through and see what is going on and what is worth reading in Outlook Express without having to open anything up. The only reason people don't like it is because it is so easy and they pretend that it makes the reply LOOK as if the person replying hasn't read the message. I don't accept this at all. I will get you some ISBNs for my books at some stage if you like? And will try to come to the show if I can sort out the fuel supply in my car which was manufactured as long ago as 1984. "Nancy Handy" wrote in message .. . Hi, Are you Hugo or Jonathan? I thought I saw you sign both names to posts. It's okay if we go off topic, the group has been rather quiet as of late. And I'm top posting because your reply was long even though I know that drives some nettiquette people crazy in this group! I was under the impression that Cliff's book was the original book, but apparently it might not have been. I have Fischler and Schneiders blue and brown books. I don't know anything about yours and I'm sure there are others in this group as well who'd like to know - what book are we talking about? Since you're here to stay and have been around for a long time, please consider giving us your name. And your book's name too! I didin't know that you were in on that show with Max. Interesting stuff. I had heard that the first NY show didn't make any money. Hearing more details that your provided about that old show was very interesting. That's the kind of "off topic" stuff we need here. And it's really very ON topic and far more interesting to those of us who weren't there. Would like to hear more! When I mentioned that Geoff arranged a NY show, I meant that he did the NY/NJ show, at least I think that's how they billed it for the years they had it there. Maybe not. All I know is I went and I liked it. I know nothing about Abe Goldrich or Murray Hoffman arranging Long Island pen get togethers in the '80's. We had a pen club a few years ago that only 3 regulars including myself showed up to. Now I'm in the process of arranging for another new Long Island Pen Club to start next month and we have about 17 people to start. We'll see how it goes in The Land of No Fountain Pens. Nancy Licensed to Quill wrote: For those coming to this thread anew, this is a continuation of a completely off-topic part of a thread which was hijacked into an ATTEMPTED flaming session by someone who is either called Edward Bonaventure who goes under the name of david moeser, presumably for anonymity purposes (or visa versa?): He had hijacked the thread into the totally fruitless, off topic and non-pen-related question (cleverly noticed by kcat, amongst others, who suspected it of being perhaps slightly hypocritical) of whether OTHERS should use anonymity in their postings. And he didn't seem to know what a by-line (and possibly an encyclopaedia) was. Nancy I am not sure I said in the thread (which you cite, -see below) that I wrote *THE* book on fountain pens, though some who were hitched onto this hobby by being given it have paid me that compliment. I said I wrote "the book which sold. . . . ." (over 200,000 copies the last time I counted, which was actually a few years ago). Lots of people think that *the*original book which got the hobby started was written by Cliff Lawrence although it wasn't without its faults: He was apparently not aware of such companies as Montblanc Mabie Todd or Namiki (etc etc etc). I personally think my first is a great book and should be bought first but that any serious collector can't really do without the Fischler and Schneider hardbacks which are somewhat more definitive. (and Frank's because you shouldn't really be heavily into this hobby in a big way without at least knowing some of the secrets of what goes on inside those pens and how to get them working) However you could be correct in what you assume as I have discussed this with numerous aficionados and no one seems to think that there are any more than about fifteen to twenty thousand serious vintage pen collectors out there world-wide absolute maximum. So presumably there are 180,000 people who think it IS *the* book? Thanks anyway for the compliment. Oh yes, BTW I was one of the organisers from its earliest days with Max and Tony Davis of the first International New York Fountain Pen Show which was held at the Roosevelt Hotel back in the '90s. It had a successful no-junk auction with a professional auctioneer flown in from England (not one of those confusing tobacco guys) , a very large number of attendees, a large ballroom along with initial entrance rooms reserved for modern pen manufacturers displays and modern pen vendors (tables in which were seen prior to, and which cost more than, those for vintage pen vendors, - a great idea which no other show has ever copied, though Washington B.C. comes close); and a generally great time was had by all who attended with the possible exception of the Davises who didn't actually make money out of it (and between two and five members of the, - then, - pen-show-arranging mafia who tried to stage a slightly pathetic 'boycott' which had almost no effect whatsoever on the success of the show but which did do those few individuals out of a great week-end and, in those days, some incredible finds). But as I said, any first show isn't a great financial success: to such an extent that they/we never held another one, plus the Roosevelt was just being bought out by Ramada at the time and was going through a huge renovation program which was a possible reason why the price to us was so cheap: Some may provide another reason: The quality of the rooms which hadn't yet been renovated left something to be desired but I accidentally missed putting anything about that in the original contract I negotiated with the hotel: Sorry Frank (who didn't get a great room). mea culpa. Not sure you are correct about Geoff having ever arranged any show in New York? (It was Max Davis who arranged those regional get-togethers at La Manganette and Abe Goldrich/Murray Hoffman who did it on Long Island in the '80s) Hugo Ripanykhazov |
#10
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Um, he's bored.
He's trying to get your goat. He's just joshing (Sorry Jonathan) He's in Halloween costume early. He thinks you take yourself too seriously (Oops, I think that) He's a W C Fields fan. He's got his fingers on the wrong spot on the QWERTY keyboard. His brain has been taken over by aliens. If you're still reading this list, what does it really matter? |
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