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Q: Translation from Hungarian, please



 
 
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  #1  
Old April 12th 12, 02:23 PM posted to rec.collecting.stamps.discuss
Victor Manta
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Posts: 1,256
Default Q: Translation from Hungarian, please

It is about the following stamps:

Hungary 1950, June 4, Children's Day, Scott 896 - 900
60 f. Boys' Camp - Scott 899 SZABAD...
60 f. Boys' Camp - Scott 899a UTANPOTLASUNK...

Michel No. 1101 - 1105 International Children's Day
No. 1104, 60 f., Young Pioneer and Tent Camp
Type I, falsely labeled: "UTANPOTLSUNK A JV HARCAIHOZ"
Type II, correctly labeled: "SZABAD HAZBAN BOLDOG IFJUSG"

Could anybody translate both labels, and eventually give me any background
information about this rare error? Many TIA.

--
Victor Manta, PWO, AIJP

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  #2  
Old April 12th 12, 07:46 PM posted to rec.collecting.stamps.discuss
Blair (TC)
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Posts: 2,199
Default Q: Translation from Hungarian, please

On Thursday, 12 April 2012 09:23:16 UTC-4, Victor Manta wrote:
It is about the following stamps:

Hungary 1950, June 4, Children's Day, Scott 896 - 900
60 f. Boys' Camp - Scott 899 SZABAD...
60 f. Boys' Camp - Scott 899a UTANPOTLASUNK...

Michel No. 1101 - 1105 International Children's Day
No. 1104, 60 f., Young Pioneer and Tent Camp
Type I, falsely labeled: "UTANPOTLSUNK A JV HARCAIHOZ"
Type II, correctly labeled: "SZABAD HAZBAN BOLDOG IFJUSG"

Could anybody translate both labels, and eventually give me any background
information about this rare error? Many TIA.

--
Victor Manta, PWO, AIJP

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Philatelic Webmasters Organization: http://pwmo.org/
Art on Stamps: http://artonstamps.org/
Romania by Stamps: http://marci-postale.com/
Communism on Stamps: http://reds-on.postalstamps.biz/
Spanish North Africa: http://www.sna-on.postalstamps.biz/
----------------------------------------------------------------------------



Hello Victor:

I have a partial translation for you.

(It's a start)

Type I (error)

The future of the partisan (UTANPOTLSUNK)

Type II (corrected)

Free (HAZBAN) happy (IFJUSG)

Note : I found a reference to the sale of
a mint corner block of Type I (Scott 899a)in 2000,
by Phillips (auctioneers) in the UK.
(no picture found online, unfortunately)

The Michel catalogue value was given as DM 20,000.00

Blair
  #3  
Old April 12th 12, 11:50 PM posted to rec.collecting.stamps.discuss
Victor Manta
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,256
Default Q: Translation from Hungarian, please

"Blair (TC)" wrote in message
news:14525213.381.1334256413770.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@vbgx21...
On Thursday, 12 April 2012 09:23:16 UTC-4, Victor Manta wrote:
It is about the following stamps:

Hungary 1950, June 4, Children's Day, Scott 896 - 900
60 f. Boys' Camp - Scott 899 SZABAD...
60 f. Boys' Camp - Scott 899a UTANPOTLASUNK...

Michel No. 1101 - 1105 International Children's Day
No. 1104, 60 f., Young Pioneer and Tent Camp
Type I, falsely labeled: "UTANPOTLSUNK A JV HARCAIHOZ"
Type II, correctly labeled: "SZABAD HAZBAN BOLDOG IFJUSG"

Could anybody translate both labels, and eventually give me any
background
information about this rare error? Many TIA.

Hello Victor:

I have a partial translation for you.

(It's a start)

Type I (error)

The future of the partisan (UTANPOTLSUNK)

Type II (corrected)

Free (HAZBAN) happy (IFJUSG)

Hello Blair,

Many thanks for your attempt.

For the Type I (the error) I have an old translation, as follows:
UTANPOTLSUNK A JV HARCAIHOZ = Our descendants for the future fights.

No idea if it is a good one. Google Translate proposes: YOUTH ACCESS THE
FUTURE Struggle.
It looks similar to what I have.

For the Type II, I have from Google: FREE HAPPY YOUTH HAZAN
It is not very useful yet :-)

The stamps are shown he

http://www.reds-on.postalstamps.biz/...1950-error.jpg
http://www.reds-on.postalstamps.biz/...950-normal.jpg

--
Victor Manta, PWO, AIJP

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Philatelic Webmasters Organization: http://pwmo.org/
Art on Stamps: http://artonstamps.org/
Romania by Stamps: http://marci-postale.com/
Communism on Stamps: http://reds-on.postalstamps.biz/
Spanish North Africa: http://www.sna-on.postalstamps.biz/
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

  #4  
Old April 13th 12, 06:50 AM posted to rec.collecting.stamps.discuss
Blair (TC)
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,199
Default Q: Translation from Hungarian, please

On Thursday, 12 April 2012 09:23:16 UTC-4, Victor Manta wrote:
It is about the following stamps:

Hungary 1950, June 4, Children's Day, Scott 896 - 900
60 f. Boys' Camp - Scott 899 SZABAD...
60 f. Boys' Camp - Scott 899a UTANPOTLASUNK...

Michel No. 1101 - 1105 International Children's Day
No. 1104, 60 f., Young Pioneer and Tent Camp
Type I, falsely labeled: "UTANPOTLSUNK A JV HARCAIHOZ"
Type II, correctly labeled: "SZABAD HAZBAN BOLDOG IFJUSG"

Could anybody translate both labels, and eventually give me any background
information about this rare error? Many TIA.

--
Victor Manta, PWO, AIJP

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Philatelic Webmasters Organization: http://pwmo.org/
Art on Stamps: http://artonstamps.org/
Romania by Stamps: http://marci-postale.com/
Communism on Stamps: http://reds-on.postalstamps.biz/
Spanish North Africa: http://www.sna-on.postalstamps.biz/
----------------------------------------------------------------------------


Thanks Victor:

I will keep looking for information.

Are you the lucky collector who has
the error stamp in your collection?

However, I suspect that stamp number two
is also in error and that in 1950,
Hungarians were neither free, nor happy.

Blair
  #5  
Old April 13th 12, 11:53 PM posted to rec.collecting.stamps.discuss
Victor Manta
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,256
Default Q: Translation from Hungarian, please

"Blair (TC)" wrote in message
news:19813333.1039.1334296204351.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@vbdn7...
On Thursday, 12 April 2012 09:23:16 UTC-4, Victor Manta wrote:
It is about the following stamps:

Hungary 1950, June 4, Children's Day, Scott 896 - 900
60 f. Boys' Camp - Scott 899 SZABAD...
60 f. Boys' Camp - Scott 899a UTANPOTLASUNK...

Michel No. 1101 - 1105 International Children's Day
No. 1104, 60 f., Young Pioneer and Tent Camp
Type I, falsely labeled: "UTANPOTLSUNK A JV HARCAIHOZ"
Type II, correctly labeled: "SZABAD HAZBAN BOLDOG IFJUSG"

Could anybody translate both labels, and eventually give me any
background
information about this rare error? Many TIA.

Thanks Victor:

I will keep looking for information.

Are you the lucky collector who has
the error stamp in your collection?

However, I suspect that stamp number two
is also in error and that in 1950,
Hungarians were neither free, nor happy.


No, unfortunately I am not in its possession.

The stamp is very interesting per se, because stamps withdrawn very quickly
from circulation usually reveal things that those who gave orders tried to
hide. That's why I need a translation I can rely on.

Meanwhile I asked on soc.culture.magyar but, apparently, they have there
other preoccupations.

You are surely right about Hungarians' freedom and happiness back in the
dark 1950th.

--
Victor Manta, PWO, AIJP

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Communism on Stamps: http://reds-on.postalstamps.biz/
Romania by Stamps: http://marci-postale.com/
Philatelic Webmasters Organization: http://pwmo.org/
Art on Stamps: http://artonstamps.org/
Spanish North Africa: http://www.sna-on.postalstamps.biz/
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

  #6  
Old April 14th 12, 02:16 PM posted to rec.collecting.stamps.discuss
gogu[_10_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 32
Default Translation from Hungarian, please

? "Victor Manta" ?????? ??? ??????
...
It is about the following stamps:

Hungary 1950, June 4, Children's Day, Scott 896 - 900
60 f. Boys' Camp - Scott 899 SZABAD...
60 f. Boys' Camp - Scott 899a UTANPOTLASUNK...

Michel No. 1101 - 1105 International Children's Day
No. 1104, 60 f., Young Pioneer and Tent Camp
Type I, falsely labeled: "UTANPOTLSUNK A JV HARCAIHOZ"
Type II, correctly labeled: "SZABAD HAZBAN BOLDOG IFJUSG"

Could anybody translate both labels, and eventually give me any background
information about this rare error? Many TIA.


Although you don't deserve it because of you ill character, I'll help you
this time:
(in your mother tongue though)

Primul:
Utanpotlaunk a jovo harcaihoz=
Inlocuitori (in sensul de IMPROSPATARE), pentru viitoarele lupte
......sau pentru luptele viitorului

Doi:
szabad hazaban boldog ifjusag=
In patria libera, tineret fericit

Shalom.

  #7  
Old April 18th 12, 04:22 PM posted to rec.collecting.stamps.discuss
Pedro
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 133
Default Translation from Hungarian, please



"gogu" wrote in message ...

? "Victor Manta" ?????? ??? ??????
...
It is about the following stamps:

Hungary 1950, June 4, Children's Day, Scott 896 - 900
60 f. Boys' Camp - Scott 899 SZABAD...
60 f. Boys' Camp - Scott 899a UTANPOTLASUNK...

Michel No. 1101 - 1105 International Children's Day
No. 1104, 60 f., Young Pioneer and Tent Camp
Type I, falsely labeled: "UTANPOTLSUNK A JV HARCAIHOZ"
Type II, correctly labeled: "SZABAD HAZBAN BOLDOG IFJUSG"

Could anybody translate both labels, and eventually give me any background
information about this rare error? Many TIA.


Although you don't deserve it because of you ill character, I'll help you
this time:
(in your mother tongue though)

Primul:
Utanpotlaunk a jovo harcaihoz=
Inlocuitori (in sensul de IMPROSPATARE), pentru viitoarele lupte
......sau pentru luptele viitorului

Doi:
szabad hazaban boldog ifjusag=
In patria libera, tineret fericit

Shalom.

the Oh so grandious and perfect philatelist Victor Manta could also be smart
enough to use google translate for so sparse words. This man really has a
real problem

Pedro

  #8  
Old April 18th 12, 10:16 PM posted to rec.collecting.stamps.discuss
Terry Reedy
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 188
Default Translation from Hungarian, please

On 4/18/2012 11:22 AM, Pedro wrote:

the Oh so grandious and perfect philatelist Victor Manta could also be
smart enough to use google translate for so sparse words.


How do you know he did not?
I tried it and the result was not very clear.

UTANPOTLÁSUNK A JÖVÖ HARCAIHOZ error
SZABAD HAZÁBAN BOLDOG IFJUSÁG corrected
to
YOUTH ACCESS THE FUTURE Struggle
FREE HAPPY YOUTH HAZAN

Please explain 'hazan' in this context and the meaning of the
'translation' in real English.

Somewhat senseless slogans do not mechanically translate very well.
For instance, Google translates the grammatical but silly slogan
Hot rocker Pedro rocks
to the supposed Hungarian
Hot rocker Pedro sziklák
Real helpful to a Hungarian who does not know English ;-)

This man really has a real problem


Off-topic claim.

tjr

  #9  
Old April 18th 12, 11:01 PM posted to rec.collecting.stamps.discuss
gogu[_9_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 54
Default Translation from Hungarian, please

"Terry Reedy"
...
On 4/18/2012 11:22 AM, Pedro wrote:


the Oh so grandious and perfect philatelist Victor Manta could also be
smart enough to use google translate for so sparse words.


How do you know he did not?
I tried it and the result was not very clear.


UTANPOTLASUNK A JOVO HARCAIHOZ error
SZABAD HAZABAN BOLDOG IFJUSAG corrected
to
YOUTH ACCESS THE FUTURE Struggle
FREE HAPPY YOUTH HAZAN


Please explain 'hazan' in this context and the meaning of the 'translation'
in real English.


Somewhat senseless slogans do not mechanically translate very well.
For instance, Google translates the grammatical but silly slogan
Hot rocker Pedro rocks
to the supposed Hungarian
Hot rocker Pedro sziklak
Real helpful to a Hungarian who does not know English ;-)



Terry, I have translated both phrases but in romanian, here it is a
translation in English:
First:
Utanpotlaunk a jovo harcaihoz=
Replacements (in the context of "renew") for the fights/struggles to come
(or "the fights/struggles of the future").
Second:
szabad hazaban boldog ifjusag=
In a free country, a happy youth.

rgrds



--

E' mai possibile, oh porco di un cane, che le avventure
in codesto reame debban risolversi tutte con grandi
puttane! F.d.A

Coins, travels and mo
http://s208.photobucket.com/albums/bb120/golanule/
http://gogu.enosi.org/index.html


  #10  
Old April 19th 12, 02:22 PM posted to rec.collecting.stamps.discuss
Victor Manta
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,256
Default [META] On Being Friendly. Was: Translation from Hungarian, please

"Pedro" wrote in message
...
the Oh so grandious and perfect philatelist Victor Manta could also be
smart enough to use google translate for so sparse words. This man really
has a real problem

Pedro


On April 12, that means 6 (!) day before the date of the posting cited
above, I posted _in_this_very_thread_ :

"Google Translate proposes: YOUTH ACCESS THE FUTURE Struggle.
It looks similar to what I have.
For the Type II, I have from Google: FREE HAPPY YOUTH HAZAN
It is not very useful yet :-)"

Therefore I wonder if it is not better to read the threads before commenting
on anything.

I also wonder if is it not better to focus on the postings' subjects, and
not on the authors of postings (risking to fall into ad hominem, etc.).

In my opinion, by choosing the first options of the above questions, each
poster can make this ng even more friendlier. Doing the opposite could push
the few remaining participants and/or newcomers toward the moderated
philatelic newsgroups.

Back to the subject, in the meantime I received by e-mail several, somehow
different translations of those two slogans on stamps. This is
understandable and for this reason I'm currently discussing the differences
with their authors.

--
Victor Manta, PWO, AIJP

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Philatelic Webmasters Organization: http://pwmo.org/
Art on Stamps: http://artonstamps.org/
Romania by Stamps: http://marci-postale.com/
Communism on Stamps: http://reds-on.postalstamps.biz/
Spanish North Africa: http://www.sna-on.postalstamps.biz/
----------------------------------------------------------------------------



 




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